9 hours ago, xrqp said:

trick Crystal Disk Info by resetting some of the hard drive metadata

https://www.dolphindatalab.com/one-click-to-clear-hard-drive-smart/

Thanks for the link.  You have confirmed my hunch.  The link said 

If the hard drive has firmware locked, users cannot reset smart at all. Users must use DFL firmware repair tools to unlock the SA and then users can click reset smart to complete the process. 

I assume that first sentence was just not written well to say "not at all".  So from the 2nd sentence it appears they can reset smart data in all cases.  Depressing.

 

So the only protection is to check warranty.  If the 5 yr warranty ends in 5 years, then the drive is probably new.

On 4/25/2022 at 9:10 AM, xrqp said:

I think a vendor who sells a lot, could trick Crystal Disk Info by resetting some of the hard drive metadata (maybe it is in firmware or a protected area of the disk). Do you think that there is a good chance they can do that?

I don't think that there's a good chance that a large volume seller would find it worth the risk exposing themselves in such a way.

Still I don't think that their discounts are all that attractive considering the shady history of the inventory. 

On 5/7/2022 at 9:44 PM, Lolight said:

I don't think that their discounts are all that attractive considering the shady history of the inventory. 

I am not sure which vendor you refer to.  Maybe Amazon vendors "tech on tech" and "hyperhawk"?  Even though there were high % DOA, they all checked out as having full warranty.  I don't know if high failure rates is the vendors fault since the shipper and the manufacturer are also involved.

On 5/11/2022 at 9:04 AM, xrqp said:

I don't know if high failure rates is the vendors fault since the shipper and the manufacturer are also involved.

High failure rates is a highly abnormal condition for HD's sold as "new".

Even if the drives come with full warranty.

There's something wrong with the source of their inventory.

Chances are that the product might have experienced adverse environmental conditions while in storage, leading to high failure rates.

There's a reason why the drives are sold at discount.

On 5/12/2022 at 1:09 AM, Lolight said:

High failure rates is a highly abnormal condition for HD's sold as "new".

I guess backblaze supports that?  You may need to clarify that it is sold as new, "and truly is new" (to eliminate if someone lies an sells it as new, but it is not new).

On 6/16/2022 at 4:38 AM, xrqp said:

that it is sold as new, "and truly is new" (to eliminate if someone lies an sells it as new, but it is not new).

New means never used and without a history of a prior (whole) sale.

Some smallish vendors resell the previously unused drives which were originally sold to a corporate customer but have never been used.

They re-sell those drives as new.

It's impossible for a retail customer to be aware of the prior sale since that info is not being disclosed and hard to track - there's no physical evidence.

Those drives almost always being re-sold at discounted to the truly new drive prices.

Why is it a big deal?

Cause they might have their factory warranties voided.

Even If the warranty is still intact there's always a risk (high probability) of those drives having a history of being exposed to a prolong storage time.

Even worse if stored for a long time in some unheated warehouse under uncontrolled environmental conditions (big daily temperature swings in winter).

 

Edited June 19, 20224 yr by Lolight

On 6/16/2022 at 4:38 AM, xrqp said:

I guess backblaze supports that?

Absolutely.

Sadly for me, Seagate has the highest failure rate at Backblaze:

 

 

And, after the 5yr warranty ends, is when the fails rapidly increase.

 

In regards to "dead on arrival" Backblaze data is unclear as far as I can tell.

Edited June 26, 20224 yr by xrqp

So I switched to WD and ordered this today at serverpartdeals.com with free shipping and no sales tax

WD Ultrastar 18TB HDD DC HC550  WUH721818ALE6L4 (0F38459)

Edited June 26, 20224 yr by xrqp

On 6/26/2022 at 8:46 AM, xrqp said:

Sadly for me, Seagate has the highest failure rate at Backblaze

Blackblaze publishes interesting reports but don't make their graphs influence your purchase decisions.

Unfortunately it looks like they're using their statistical data reports to attract publicity.

Their methodologies are sketchy: worthless data lead to misleading conclusions.

I used to respect their findings until they decided to publish this gem: https://www.backblaze.com/blog/hard-drive-temperature-does-it-matter/

"As long as you run drives well within their allowed range of operating temperatures, keeping them cooler doesn’t matter."

 

Here's a good article on Backblaze's HDD Reliability Myth:

https://www.tweaktown.com/articles/6028/dispelling-backblaze-s-hdd-reliability-myth-the-real-story-covered/index.html

Edited June 27, 20224 yr by Lolight

I got the WD Ultrastar and running preclears now.  The body of the drive feels stronger and heavier than the Seagates.  It seems like thick cast metal in some places.  I like it.

Edit:  Ran preclear twice.  Stayed at same temperature, or 1°C cooler than, the Seagates.

 

Discussion on Hard drive sweet spot continued here: after Nov-2022, hard-drive-size-sweet-spot-still-18tb

Edited April 24, 20233 yr by xrqp

On 2/20/2022 at 5:50 PM, RecycledBits said:

 

Is that something new? I have personally never experienced this with Seagate. They have always honored the 5 years warranty and I always just choose the cheapest supplier here in Denmark. 

 

The only time I have experienced something simular was with WD drives. It was impossible to see from the model number and it came as a very big surprise for me that the drive only came with 1 year warranty (and died after 1½ year). This was around the WD Red SMR scandal and I haven't purchased WD since. 

 

 

Hi also from Denmark.

Considering ordering Seagate recertified from ServerPartDeals, but if something is wrong with the drives, would I then be able to contact Seagate in Denmark and return it to them instead of sending back to US?

22 minutes ago, Bjur said:

Considering ordering Seagate recertified from ServerPartDeals

In my personal experience that is not a very good idea, I've worked with a lot of recertified drives and at best there's a 50/50 change of them not failing in the first few weeks of use.

17 hours ago, JorgeB said:

In my personal experience that is not a very good idea, I've worked with a lot of recertified drives and at best there's a 50/50 change of them not failing in the first few weeks of use.

Damn that was not the answer I was hoping for:( I've seen others mention many of their recertified Exos was perfectly fine, since it was enterprise.

Edited January 25, 20242 yr by Bjur

4 minutes ago, Bjur said:

I've seen others mention many of their recertified Exos was perfectly fine, since it was enterprise.

I guess it's possible, I can only comment on my experience in general with recertified drives.

One or two years ago I bought about 4 of the recertified Seagate exos 18TB from serverpartsdeals.  No problem so far.  I researched it a bit (weak research and results) but I got the Seagate parameters of what qualifies as recertified, and it seemed good considering the big discount.