Unable to access Unraid server with hostname from Windows 10 machine behind access point in my network.

[fugumagu]

First, I'm very new to Unraid, so apologies in advance if this is a dumb question.

TLDR: I can't access Unraid shares via the host name while on a computer behind an access point. Accessing other computer shares on the network and accessing Unraid via the IP address all work fine from a computer behind an access point.

 

I have a router set up in access point mode to improve WiFi signal upstairs. This router is connected to my main router via ethernet cable. My Unraid server is also connected to the main router via ethernet cable. While on a Windows 10 computer connected to the main router, I have no issues connecting to Unraid under the Network list in File Explorer; I can see \\Tower and open the shares just fine.

 

However, while on an upstairs computer connected to the access point, I can see \\Tower in File Explorer but cannot open it. I get the "Windows cannot access \\Tower. Check the spelling of the name..." error (0x80070035). I am able to type the IP address into File Explorer and access the shares this way though. I can also click on the computer name of any of the other computers in the Network list and access those shared files just fine.

 

If I bypass the access point and plug the upstairs computer directly into the ethernet cable that was previously plugged into the access point, I am now able to click on \\Tower and open the shares. It fixes the issue.

 

Is this normal operation? Can I make it so I can click on \\Tower and open the shares from a computer on the access point?

 

I've searched through the forum and tried the following on the machine behind the access point:

1. Turning on SMB 1.0 in Windows Features
2. Enabling insecure guest logons via Local Group Policy Editor > Computer Configuration > Administrative Templates > Network > Lanman Workstation
3. Enabling NetBIOS over TCP/IP via Ethernet > Properties > Internet Procol Version 4 (TCP/IPv4) Properties > Advanced > WINS tab
4. Enabling SMB 2.0 in Powershell with the "Set-SmbServerConfiguration -EnableSMB2Protocol $true" command

 

None of the above steps have fixed the issue.

 

[Frank1940]

2 hours ago, fugumagu said:

If I bypass the access point and plug the upstairs computer directly into the ethernet cable that was previously plugged into the access point, I am now able to click on \\Tower and open the shares. It fixes the issue.

I would consider 'fixing' this by purchasing a $20US 5 port Gb switch and a couple of short cat5 cables.   Troubleshooting SMB network problems is not for the beginner.

[philliphartmanjr]

It could be a smb problem it may also just be a issue with your set up. I am a little confused on your setup. Are you using 2 modem, router, gateway, wifi combo devices? If so are you sure the one you are using as an access point is compatible? If it is is the access point in bridge mode? if everything was working fine before and your issue is only from the access point iI would personally start there.

 

[fugumagu]

2 minutes ago, philliphartmanjr said:

It could be a smb problem it may also just be a issue with your set up. I am a little confused on your setup. Are you using 2 modem, router, gateway, wifi combo devices? If so are you sure the one you are using as an access point is compatible? If it is is the access point in bridge mode? if everything was working fine before and your issue is only from the access point iI would personally start there.

 

I wouldn't be surprised if it was my setup since I'm nowhere near an expert in networking. I have a standalone modem going to a standalone wireless router (TP Link Archer A10). The router doesn't have modem functionality at all. I have an ethernet cable going upstairs where I have it plugged into another wireless router (an old Belkin N600 router, not a modem combo device) and it is running in Access Point mode. I actually just looked up the date the Belkin router came out; it's about a decade old. Might be the cause.

 

My entire awareness of Unraid's existence is only a couple weeks old, so I'm still figuring it out. I only tried to access the server from upstairs yesterday when I noticed the issue. I'm not sure if the router being used as an access point is compatible with the main router or if it is in bridge mode. However, knowing that compatibility and bridge mode is "a thing" is hugely helpful and gives me a direction in which I can do more research and learning. 

 

I might take Frank1940's advice above and use a Gb switch to solve this. Or get an up-to-date router. Or just not worry about accessing the server via it's host name from upstairs.

[dasx86]

edited: I did not read the original post correctly - seems like something is going on with name resolution (NetBIOS?)

 

This is not an SMB issue.

 

I think by having a router (as an access point) downstream from another router, you've actually created two separate networks.  I would guess that any computer connected to the "access point" cannot even ping another machine that's on the upstream router's network, and vice versa.

 

I believe you could set up manual routing between the two, but I don't think this will be intuitive at all (if even possible) on the regular consumer gear I'm assuming you have.

 

I would focus on investing in a better networking setup - one where multiple access points are actually the same network.   I've been happy with my Ubiquiti gear.  If I were in your situation and starting from scratch, I'd look at a Ubiquiti UDM Pro, plus two access points - one for where your router is now, and another for where you've extended your network with another access point.  Ubiquiti makes it easy to have multiple access points on the same network. It's a bit pricey though - perhaps others can chime in with other recommendations.  Good luck

Edited January 23, 2023 by dasx86
reading comprehension

[fugumagu]

1 hour ago, Frank1940 said:

I would consider 'fixing' this by purchasing a $20US 5 port Gb switch and a couple of short cat5 cables.   Troubleshooting SMB network problems is not for the beginner.

I might actually just do this since I have a spare 5 port Gb switch lying around. 

[fugumagu]

Just now, dasx86 said:

This is not an SMB issue.

 

I think by having a router (as an access point) downstream from another router, you've actually created two separate networks.  I would guess that any computer connected to the "access point" cannot even ping another machine that's on the upstream router's network, and vice versa.

 

I believe you could set up manual routing between the two, but I don't think this will be intuitive at all (if even possible) on the regular consumer gear I'm assuming you have.

 

I would focus on investing in a better networking setup - one where multiple access points are actually the same network.   I've been happy with my Ubiquiti gear.  If I were in your situation and starting from scratch, I'd look at a Ubiquiti UDM Pro, plus two access points - one for where your router is now, and another for where you've extended your network with another access point.  Ubiquiti makes it easy to have multiple access points on the same network. It's a bit pricey though - perhaps others can chime in with other recommendations.  Good luck

Thanks for the advice! From the computer behind the access point, I am able to successfully ping the Unraid server and any other computer upstream from the access point. I am just now looking up the date for the access point router and it is quite old. I wouldn't be surprised if it was just too old but I really have no clue where to start looking if it is or not. Best thing I could do is just get another router that is the same as the main router or even do what you're recommending and check out the Ubiquiti option. I'm definitely getting good information on this and am gratful for your input!

[dasx86]

Sorry, I skimmed your first post and didn't read thoroughly enough - so I think some of what I said in my prior post is inaccurate too.  But, it still sounds like you're trying to piece together a network with what you have on hand, and it's resulting in some undesired behavior.

 

I don't think the age of the "access point router" has anything to do with it.  I wouldn't recommend replacing it with the same router as your "main" router, unless that model is set up with ability to chain together multiple to "bridge and extend" another router.

Not sure if you're just new to Unraid or you're new to servers and Linux in general - some people start in this hobby by running an extra laptop with an external hard drive, fast forward 2 years and they're running a setup like this guy.  So if that's you, maybe this is an excuse to level up your network hardware 🤷‍♂️😆

Edited January 23, 2023 by dasx86

[fugumagu]

3 minutes ago, dasx86 said:

Sorry, I skimmed your first post and didn't read thoroughly enough - so I think some of what I said in my prior post is inaccurate too.  But, it still sounds like you're trying to piece together a network with what you have on hand, and it's resulting in some undesired behavior.

 

I don't think the age of the "access point router" has anything to do with it.  I wouldn't recommend replacing it with the same router as your "main" router, unless that model is set up with ability to chain together multiple to "bridge and extend" another router.

Not sure if you're just new to Unraid or you're new to servers and Linux in general - some people start in this hobby by running an extra laptop with an external hard drive, fast forward 2 years and they're running a setup like this guy.  So if that's you, maybe this is an excuse to level up your network hardware 🤷‍♂️😆

Yeah, that's pretty much me. I saw something online somewhere that said something to the effect of "Did you know you can use your old router as an access point and boost your WiFi?". I thought, sweet, I have an old one laying around. I got it working and everything was great! I'm definitely new to/inexperienced in all of the above (Unraid, servers, and Linux) but am learning a lot so far just by getting my hands dirty and trying things out. I think the next step is for me to budget for some new network hardware for sure since I'm working with oldish stuff. 

[philliphartmanjr]

what you have may work if you access your belkin device you can look to see if it can be placed in bridge mode. what bridge mode does is it turns off the devices ability to create a network and instead will receive network information from your main device. that is if you want to try and get that setup working. other wise you can do the switch it will work as well. If you did want to have wireless access I would recommend a good wireless repeater. Yes another device working as an access point is better I personally would stay with tp link if you purchased a new one for an access point. Mixing different brands can often lead to some weirdness.

[dasx86]

1 minute ago, fugumagu said:

Yeah, that's pretty much me. I saw something online somewhere that said something to the effect of "Did you know you can use your old router as an access point and boost your WiFi?". I thought, sweet, I have an old one laying around. I got it working and everything was great! I'm definitely new to/inexperienced in all of the above (Unraid, servers, and Linux) but am learning a lot so far just by getting my hands dirty and trying things out. I think the next step is for me to budget for some new network hardware for sure since I'm working with oldish stuff. 

 

Cool, welcome to the hobby!

 

If you can set up that 5 port switch upstairs, then plug your "access point" and that PC into that switch, I think that'll address the immediate need.  I think you might be putting clients downstream from the "access point" into a double NAT situation (and maybe that has something to do with your current issue?)  I'm not enough of a networking guy to explain why double NAT is a problem, I just know enough to know if you put yourself in that situation unintentionally with consumer gear, problems can arise

[fugumagu]

1 hour ago, dasx86 said:

 

Cool, welcome to the hobby!

 

If you can set up that 5 port switch upstairs, then plug your "access point" and that PC into that switch, I think that'll address the immediate need.  I think you might be putting clients downstream from the "access point" into a double NAT situation (and maybe that has something to do with your current issue?)  I'm not enough of a networking guy to explain why double NAT is a problem, I just know enough to know if you put yourself in that situation unintentionally with consumer gear, problems can arise

I checked the Belkin router and it does not appear to have bridge mode, only access point mode. I plugged the switch upstream of the access point router and plugged the upstairs computer into the switch. That definitely fixed the issue. Not sure if the access point was causing the double NAT or what but I'd be interested in seeing a newer router with bridge mode works. 

 

I'm thankful for your help!

[philliphartmanjr]

access point setting should  be the same thing as bridge mode could be an issue with different venders not working well together or different types of supported wifi standards or both. Could also be a setting in the Tp link to let it know there is another device being used as an access point. If it was setup as an access point then double Nat was not likely the issue. I have not used either of those brands for a while but i know with asus models they work well together because the main router acts a a controller for the rest. If you are looking at new options unifi is really good as well.