SSD unRaid?

[Tedd]

A little off the beaten path.

 

I know the ssd drive cost will be a cash hit... I have all the computer hardware except storage drives so

that helps. I'm thinking three 500-640 ssd drives would get me started and more then cover my cd library

and allow me some high resolution files storage.

 

I am envisioning a silent dedicated stereo music server to pair with a Bryston BDP-1 and Ipad as a front end.

[Tedd]

Hardware I have:

 

Supermicro C2SEE motherboard with

Intel dual core processor (don't recall what model)

2G ram

rack mount case with Thermaltake TR2 430W power supply

64G ssd

4G jumpdrive

more then enough SATA2 cables

 

[aiden]

I am envisioning a silent dedicated stereo music server to pair with a Bryston BDP-1 and Ipad as a front end.

 

Obviously you're trying to create something audiophile in nature by removing mechanical spindle noise. I would humbly submit it is possible to eliminate such noise using a well sound-proofed case and passively cooled PSU. It would be a much less expensive alternative to using SSDs, which have a less then stellar reliability compared to their mechanical brethren.

[WeeboTech]

I remember there also being a product that was a sound absorbing pad on one side and a sticky pad on the other.

I've used it for a few of my noisy servers and it helped a little.

Can't seem to find the product I used to use. Askamate or something like that.

Silverstone has a product out now.

 

There's an article in July 2008 of maximum PC's pdf archives about sound proofing your case.

http://www.maximumpc.com/article/pdf_archives/july_2008_pc_hardware_hacks

http://dl.maximumpc.com/Archives/MPC0708-web.pdf

 

see also  -> http://www.acousticpc.com/

 

However, before investing all that money in SSD's I would consider locating the server in a different part of the house instead.

The 5400 RPM drives can be pretty quiet and a good quality PSU can be pretty quiet too.

[Tedd]

 

 

Definately an audiophile system component.  But it's more of the av rack is "in the room" thing. That said, I could hang the case vertically on the back wall of the av closet.

 

I've done many htpcs over the years. I've used three passively cooled PSU's in the past, and all failed. No luck there... Add in one PMI SDI capture card, and that's

every htpc related hardware failure I've had.

 

Do I even need to assign a parity drive with unRaid? Could I use unRaid as a simple jumpdrive server in this manner? I'd back up to a hard drive elsewhere on the network.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[WeeboTech]

Do I even need to assign a parity drive with unRaid? Could I use unRaid as a simple jumpdrive server in this manner? I'd back up to a hard drive elsewhere on the network.

 

You don't have to assign a parity drive, you can use unRAID as an unprotected JBOD fileserver.

The usershares would still let the individual filesystems be seen as one.

[aiden]

I've done many htpcs over the years. I've used three passively cooled PSU's in the past, and all failed. No luck there...

 

Ever tried a picoPSU, like this - http://www.mini-box.com/picoPSU-160-XT?

 

 

You can also add external bricks to increase the power.  But if you're only going to run a few drives, 160W should be plenty.

[marcusone]

Careful with the picopsu as its power "brick" only handles a max of 120w (the 160w is the rating of the connector not Whats powering it)

 

Sent from my SGH-I727R using Tapatalk

[jamerson9]

If your willing to spend that much on SSDs, then why not have two machines. One server in an out of the way place to do all the storage and heavy lifting, such as running the capture card, making as much noise as it pleases. Then a no moving parts htpc in the room to play the media.

[lionelhutz]

You can also use one of these;

 

http://www.ebay.ca/itm/130W-mini-ITX-ATX-Power-Supply-DC-DC-PicoPSU-and-AC-adapter-120W-Y5-/170784440651?pt=PCA_UPS&hash=item27c38bc14b

 

Either power supply is more than enough for say a Fusion or Atom board and some SSD's (You could likely run 10+ SSD's off either one). With the Fusion, buy a fanless board and the whole server would be silent. Hey, if you want silent that power supply and CPU will both have fans which will basically make the silent SSD a waste.

 

Peter

[publicENEMY]

If your willing to spend that much on SSDs, then why not have two machines. One server in an out of the way place to do all the storage and heavy lifting, such as running the capture card, making as much noise as it pleases. Then a no moving parts htpc in the room to play the media.

 

i was gonna say the exact same thing. why use unraid as music server? unraid is file server. built a dedicated music server that silent.

 

i wonder about few things. why would you want unraid to store less than 1 terabytes files? you want to use unraid to store music files? is your music files has huge file size(like bluray) or you have extremely lots of music files? what is the problem that you have that you want unraid to solve?

 

Im building a silent htpc. the key to silence is no fan and no mechanically moving parts at all. also consider reducing/removing electrical buzz if you experience one.

 

i would recommend

music server/player in your listening room

1. use heatsink cases

2. lowest power processor that meet your requirement(65w is recommended)

3. use ssd

4. good ventilation. fanless system generates the same amount of heat as the fans one. you have to plan where these heat goes.

5. pico psu

 

file server

1. you can find lots of example in this forum. since the file server is remote or hidden is a closet, you dont have to worry about noise.

 

if you must have fan, make sure the fan have variable speed(high rpm when hot, low rpm when cool). also, its important to use fans that are made for silence. cheap silence fans while quiet at first, will make louder noise as time goes by. high quality fans can be quiet for a very long time. recommended quiet fans are from noctua.

 

 

Again, why unraid?

[lionelhutz]

I forgot about this one. The Bryston BDP-1 web page says it will play files from USB drives. unRAID serves media over an ethernet connection, not USB.

[jamerson9]

I forgot about this one. The Bryston BDP-1 web page says it will play files from USB drives. unRAID serves media over an ethernet connection, not USB.

I just downloaded the manual out of curiosity and been scratching my head for bit as it has an ethernet port, but no mention of how to mount network shares. Just keeps going on about USB storage devices. It seems the ethernet port is used only for controlling the unit, by other networked devices.

[Tedd]

Never used a Picopsu. I doubt one could power any of the htpcs I've built, which don't fit today's common profile of a htpc.

 

The BDP-1 is actually a task specific Linux computer. That task is a high end music streamer, to output stereo music files to a DAC.

The most commonly used media input is an external usb hard drive attached to the rear usb ports, or music on usb jump drives.

Definately a different animal, but one that sounds better then my Asus Xonar and RME 9632. The ethernet port is for a wireless router,

and IPad as remote.

 

As for ssd's, is a buck or two, for storing a ripped cd, really all that expensive? As for hardware, it's all in place, leftovers, zero expenditure.

And there's other pc hardware to sell off, and re-invest in ssd drives. Out of pocket will start around the 600-700M storage mark.

 

As for unRaid, very simple attached storage would work, with multiple backups.  (just exploring UnRaid at this point...)

Ripping isn't so bad, but proper tagging is time consuming.

Some redundency to protect that time investment is one goal. As for storage needs, 900 cd library and a growing high resolution stereo music files.

Bluray will stay disk based.

 

There's no storage area, save for the Middle Atlantic slim5 rack in the basement familyroom area.

 

 

[lionelhutz]

OK, have fun with your server. I was just very confused about the expressed desire to build a silent music server when I read your parts list which, to me, would be far from silent and to me it wouldn't add any significant noise to what you have by just using a single large HDD.

 

Also, the PS was mentioned as a possibility to use in a small, silent SSD server, not for a HTPC.

 

I still don't know how you are getting the data from the server ethernet port to the Bryston USB port but I suppose you have something figured out. But I recall there being some kind of USB stick which wirelessly connects to a network and makes the share appear like local storage on the stick.

 

[Rajahal]

I can definitely see the appeal of this project.  I've built my own SSD-only servers and played around with them a bit.  A fully SSD array (parity and data) is fast enough that a cache drive becomes completely pointless.  I routinely saw write speeds in excess of 90 MB/s, and I was using budget SATA II SSDs.  More modern (and more expensive) SSDs should be even faster, and start approaching the theoretical limit of 125 MB/s.  However, not being an audiophile, I eventually relented and re-introduced some spinners.  My latest iteration is a hybrid server - some HDDs for mass storage, and some SSDs for small, often-accessed files.  I could definitely see keeping a modest music collection on SSDs, but mine is around 1 TB at the moment, so that won't work.

[Tedd]

 

Peter, the BDP-1's ethernet port connects to the wireless router and the router's ethernet ports are the cable modem/computer(s)/server connectivity. Wireless for IPAd control/navigation

of the BDP-1, or front buttons, or optional remote.  The usb ports are still an option for media playback.

 

The computer parts are suitable. The cpu heatsink and fan are aftermarket. And it's a 4U rackmount case, not a 1U or 2U.

Changing out the motherboard/cpu/ram is an option.

 

Gotchya on the picopsu, but I can see this server growing with time. (I also just realised I wrote 6-700M, and not 6-700G...)

Pretty sure I'm around 1TB in music at this point. 

 

Nice to know a ssd server is viable, Rajahal.  I was guessing a cache drive would be pointless.

[WeeboTech]

I could definitely see keeping a modest music collection on SSDs, but mine is around 1 TB at the moment, so that won't work.

I'm almost at 6TB.. I'm thinking of a mini unRAID server just for music. Way too many files!

That's why the concept of SSD for unRAID music is so foreign to me.

One can still dream!

[publicENEMY]

I can definitely see the appeal of this project.  I've built my own SSD-only servers and played around with them a bit.  A fully SSD array (parity and data) is fast enough that a cache drive becomes completely pointless.  I routinely saw write speeds in excess of 90 MB/s, and I was using budget SATA II SSDs.  More modern (and more expensive) SSDs should be even faster, and start approaching the theoretical limit of 125 MB/s.  However, not being an audiophile, I eventually relented and re-introduced some spinners.  My latest iteration is a hybrid server - some HDDs for mass storage, and some SSDs for small, often-accessed files.  I could definitely see keeping a modest music collection on SSDs, but mine is around 1 TB at the moment, so that won't work.

 

i dont see a reason to use full ssd unraid array for home usage. what application requires such fast transfer rate?

[Tedd]

I was wondering when that issue would also get mentioned... 

 

It's not about transfer rate, it's about a silent server, in the listening enviroment, feeding a high end stereo system.

 

A 6TB music collection on ssd, would be a bit of an expense. Now if I had some out of the way, server "friendly" space,

life would be simple and I'm just a 2TB drive away from a 6TB+ Unraid.

[Rajahal]

Exactly, there are other benefits to SSDs besides just the speed.  Low heat, silent, low power requirements, better handling of lots of small files (such as music, photos, and documents), etc.

[Tedd]

Just acquired a pair of 120G ssd SATA2 drives to go with a 60G I already have. 

 

$1.10 per Gig, ssd bay adapters included.

 

I was thinking my next ssds need to be 240G mimimum, as the motherboard has six SATA2 ports. 

But I'm kind of leaning to add a controller card to add ports now.  That way I contain parity drive cost, have

cheaper storage cost per Gig (by sticking with 120-128G capacity drives), plus have a few ports left for

future expansion room.  Seven more 120G ssds should get me below the $1.00 per cd mark (wav files). 

Recovered cash from upgraded hardware should half that expense.

 

If one 3.5" drive bay can handle two ssds back to back, all the ssds can end up in the 3.5 bay cage.

Nice and simple.

[lionelhutz]

I think you can fit 4 SSD's in a 3.5" drive slot. Someone makes a hot-swap bay that does it. 2 or 3 of them would make a great server to use. You just open the door and insert the drive.

[ohlwiler]

Seven more 120G ssds should get me below the $1.00 per cd mark (wav files).

 

Why no lossless compression?

[Tedd]

I think I've seen those hot swap bays but they were 4 (2 high by 2 wide) in a 5.25" bay.

 

I do have three 5.25  bays but I'm leaning cheap and use what's on hand, and aim the cash

at the ssd storage. The OCZ drives I just bought, came with shallow U shaped brackets so

I was thinking back to back mounting in each bay if the 3.5" bays have suitable double slots.

 

Just checked, no such luck. But the cage is 6 drives wide. A little 3.5" bay modding is in order.