I used unraid 4.7 for a year without issue.  Then about a year ago I lost 4TB of semi-replaceable data due to Extremely poor support from Tom at Lime tech.  I would have lost ZERO data if Tom had provided an adequate level of support.  http://lime-technology.com/forum/index.php?topic=18550

 

Now I've ran into a catastrophic failure (8TB+ lost) and the community has exhausted its efforts while Tom is nowhere to be found.  http://lime-technology.com/forum/index.php?topic=23568  and  http://lime-technology.com/forum/index.php?topic=23723.0

 

Overall unraid is not a bad Free product, but when you've bought a Pro license and the company you paid money to is ZERO help when you run into a problem, that only they can answer, is unacceptable.

 

On top of that we were promised a final version of 5.0 by end of Feb. 2012 and it's almost 2013 with no final version of 5.0 in sight.  Another extreme failure on Limetech.

 

So I've now decided to move on and buy a synology DS1812+ because I know that if I have something go wrong I won't lose anywhere nearly the amount of data I've lost over the last year and Synology actually provides support to their end users.

If you haven't backed up your critical data DO IT NOW.  That’s the only thing that saved me from losing 10 years of priceless data.

 

Did you have your data backed up?

 

Using any type of parity protection disk system is not a backup, this includes but isn't limited to raid 1, raid 5, raid 10, hardware failure on any of these systems can and will leave your data unreliable. The only true method of ensuring data is never lost is to have it on multiple strategies, one local, one remote. Tape Local, HD remote, etc and so forth, take your pick.

 

I feel to blame the OS & software on this failure is as of now, fairly misleading. you haven't proven beyond a shadow of a doubt the hardware failed, you didn't do a memory test (which will lead you to a bad mobo or cpu as well as bad ram) a disk controller test, a cpu test, or a motherboard test.

 

You could have had hardware failure, memory, disk controller, motherboard, PSU or even CPU. Any type of raid won't protect you against any of these faults, they will only protect you against the most common of storage failures, which is a failed disk.

 

I as well would of pressed the subject a bit more since your data failure appears to of happened around ThanksGiving Weekend. I'm not excusing anybody, but man we are all running around with our heads cut off around that period.

Your last issue was an odd one. The partitions on your disks didn't appear correct for unRAID.

 

On the plus  side, if you set up a RAID5 on the Synology then you'll lose all your data when an equivalent 2-disk failure occurs.

On the plus side, if you set up a RAID5 on the Synology then you'll lose all your data when an equivalent 2-disk failure occurs.

 

THIS is why I'm worried when I come here for advice or support.  I'll be first to admit I know almost nothing about linux and absolutely nothing about the internal workings of unraid.  And to its credit, it's been so doggedly reliable [for me] that I've had no opportunity to even attempt at resolving anything catastrophic.  But it's been made VERY clear in seeing the responses to others' frustrations, that criticism is akin to questioning religious dogma. 

 

It's a worrisome feeling to know that you're completely at the mercy of a group of talented and knowledgeable USERS whose response can hinge on whether you have demonstrated the proper submissive stance.  Maybe tgggd86 was a complete ass when he asked Tom for support...maybe that's why Tom didn't respond.  I don't know- but neither does anyone else, here.  I'm not condoning his tone or his attitude, but I certainly understand his frustration.  I'd be frustrated if I'd lost that much data while feeling unsupported!  I worked technical support for 7 years, and I know that people [do] vent sometimes.  I don't think his post was over-the-top.  He expressed his frustrations....which he had for a reason! 

 

To be glib in the face of his frustrations- only justifies the negative sentiments that are now certainly cemented for him [for unraid] and undermines the confidence of users who are browsing these forums.

Did you have your data backed up?

 

Using any type of parity protection disk system is not a backup, this includes but isn't limited to raid 1, raid 5, raid 10, hardware failure on any of these systems can and will leave your data unreliable. The only true method of ensuring data is never lost is to have it on multiple strategies, one local, one remote. Tape Local, HD remote, etc and so forth, take your pick.

 

I feel to blame the OS & software on this failure is as of now, fairly misleading. you haven't proven beyond a shadow of a doubt the hardware failed, you didn't do a memory test (which will lead you to a bad mobo or cpu as well as bad ram) a disk controller test, a cpu test, or a motherboard test.

 

You could have had hardware failure, memory, disk controller, motherboard, PSU or even CPU. Any type of raid won't protect you against any of these faults, they will only protect you against the most common of storage failures, which is a failed disk.

 

I understood when I went to Unraid it was not a fail-proof backup, really no one solution is.  The data I lost was; personal data I had backed up on a external stored in another state, TBs of Blu-Ray/DVD/CD rips I still have copies of.  So mainly what I lost was time, which to me is extremely valuable working 60-70 hours a week.

 

I worked in computer repair for ten years.  I would NEVER run to the community here to only waste their time because my hardware caused the problem.  I ran PC check multiple times and Memtest about a dozen times.  All drives were visible in the BIOS it was just the simple fact unraid refused to accept my 2TB drives.

I as well would of pressed the subject a bit more since your data failure appears to of happened around ThanksGiving Weekend. I'm not excusing anybody, but man we are all running around with our heads cut off around that period.

 

I waited a month, I wasn't going to wait 3+ like I did on my last failure.  I don't blame this community, which has saved my butt before, I blame Tom and Limetech's utter failure to support it's end users.

 

Your last issue was an odd one. The partitions on your disks didn't appear correct for unRAID.

 

On the plus  side, if you set up a RAID5 on the Synology then you'll lose all your data when an equivalent 2-disk failure occurs.

 

I only had one disk actually go bad (disk 11) when I went to have it rebuilt by parity all my 2TB drives became seen as unformatted by unraid.  This had happened before and Tom gave up on it.

 

On the plus side, if you set up a RAID5 on the Synology then you'll lose all your data when an equivalent 2-disk failure occurs.

 

THIS is why I'm worried when I come here for advice or support.  I'll be first to admit I know almost nothing about linux and absolutely nothing about the internal workings of unraid.  And to its credit, it's been so doggedly reliable [for me] that I've had no opportunity to even attempt at resolving anything catastrophic.  But it's been made VERY clear in seeing the responses to others' frustrations, that criticism is akin to questioning religious dogma. 

 

It's a worrisome feeling to know that you're completely at the mercy of a group of talented and knowledgeable USERS whose response can hinge on whether you have demonstrated the proper submissive stance.  Maybe tgggd86 was a complete ass when he asked Tom for support...maybe that's why Tom didn't respond.  I don't know- but neither does anyone else, here.  I'm not condoning his tone or his attitude, but I certainly understand his frustration.  I'd be frustrated if I'd lost that much data while feeling unsupported!  I worked technical support for 7 years, and I know that people [do] vent sometimes.  I don't think his post was over-the-top.  He expressed his frustrations....which he had for a reason! 

 

To be glib in the face of his frustrations- only justifies the negative sentiments that are now certainly cemented for him [for unraid] and undermines the confidence of users who are browsing these forums.

 

I'm glad I'm not the only one who feels this way 

 

My conversations with Tom went from professional to irritated.  He only began responding after I explained my frustration after a fifth e-mail and one month going by without a reply.  Then basically threw up his hands at my problem and said it was unfixable.  I am MORE than happy to post my e-mails with him in this thread.

... It's a worrisome feeling to know that you're completely at the mercy of a group of talented and knowledgeable USERS whose response can hinge on whether you have demonstrated the proper submissive stance.  ...

 

This statement is really bothering me & my response is to this statement (not to the original topic).

 

This forum is full of people that are trying to help each other. We are not being paid like tech support to deal with belligerence. Yes, when something goes wrong it causes frustration. Those of us that are trying to help are not looking for submissiveness, but the saying "you catch more flies with honey than you do with vinegar" applies. If you want something (in this case knowledge/assistance) & you aren't paying for it (we are users, not limetech staff or tech support)... don't slap the person/people offering a helping hand.

 

TL/DR - being civil to get what you want does not = submission.

 

---

 

tgggd86 - I have only needed help from limetech / Tom once & received a prompt reply. I've seen other posts stating similar results to mine. I am sorry to see your results were different.

 

When I was deciding which kind of system I wanted for my data, I saw unRAID would allow me to use my hardware, was Linux (I am an advanced Linux user though I learn new things about it still), it appeared very customizable with extra features & had an active forum. I knew a drawback was that hardware was not standard (making troubleshooting more difficult than a prebuilt system like drobo or synology), but I enjoy customizing my system to fit my needs & am willing to spend time getting everything the way I want. From what I am reading, it seems like the nonstandard system was part of the issue with the support you received & since you see time as more valuable due to your work schedule... perhaps synology (or another prebuilt / hardware standard system) will be a better fit for you.  As lionelhutz mentioned, you can still lose your data due to disk failure... & would have to spend time restoring from backup if that did happen.

 

I wish you good luck & hope that you find a good fit for your needs.

I only had one disk actually go bad (disk 11) when I went to have it rebuilt by parity all my 2TB drives became seen as unformatted by unraid.

 

Yes, but many people have had the partitioning changed and corrected it using the methods outlined in some threads I listed without it becoming a data loss issue. However, in your case the file system on the disks did not match anything unRAID normally creates. At that point, my guess was that you did something odd to the disks that you conveniently didn't mention and I could not help further so I didn't respond again.

 

Overall, the worst cases occur when someone makes a small issue bigger by going off in a panic and randomly trying to fix it by doing things in different randon orders hoping something good happens - starting/stopping/un-assigning/assigning/moving/formatting/initconf - instead of stopping and assessing the issue and possibly getting help so they can create a plan for recovery.

 

This statement is really bothering me & my response is to this statement (not to the original topic).

 

This forum is full of people that are trying to help each other. We are not being paid like tech support to deal with belligerence.

 

Exactly- so why escalate the negativity by returning the sentiment?  I TOTALLY agree- these support forums have some the most dedicated and talented users I've ever seen in a user base...for any software.  The level of support and dedication shown in these forums is a huge part of why I chose Unraid.  It's one thing to inspect the support forums for the level of reported troubles, but it was seeing those users' problems being resolved, that won me over.  And I'll give Tom credit- he's basically a ghost on here, but he's always responded to the few direct questions I have emailed. 

 

But it does bother me to see a significant entity (and source of support) being glib in the face of a user's obvious frustration.  While nobody here IS being paid to support unraid, like-it-or-not, they [are] a major factor in the product's reputation.  In MY mind, Tom owes them all for much of unraid's success.  It's a great product, and the low level of genuine complaints, is a testament to not only the software, but to their efforts.  In terms of questions asked and concerns allayed, users have given me more support than Tom.  The conditions [where unraid is typically used] don't lend themselves to casual discourse when a catastrophic event occurs.  IF total losses were even an unusual occurrence, these forums would be littered with venom....because nobody is more vocal than an enraged user;  i.e unraid is obviously one rock-solid piece of software.  And I hold it in high regard.  But I also hold in high regard, the users who (again, like-it-or-not) are 'the face' of the software to users like myself.  And with high regard, come high standards.

 

And on a more personal note- technical support personnel aren't being paid to deal with belligerence, either.  They're being paid to assist you with your problem. 

I only had one disk actually go bad (disk 11) when I went to have it rebuilt by parity all my 2TB drives became seen as unformatted by unraid.

 

Yes, but many people have had the partitioning changed and corrected it using the methods outlined in some threads I listed without it becoming a data loss issue. However, in your case the file system on the disks did not match anything unRAID normally creates. At that point, my guess was that you did something odd to the disks that you conveniently didn't mention and I could not help further so I didn't respond again.

 

Overall, the worste cases occur when someone makes a small issue bigger by going off in a panic and randomly trying to fix it by doing things in different randon orders hoping something good happens - starting/stopping/un-assigning/assigning/moving/formatting/initconf - instead of stopping and assessing the issue and possibly getting help so they can create a plan for recovery.

 

 

Lionel, you are completely wrong.  When I first had a problem with my server I left it off and didn't touch it for a week so I didn't try and panic and screw something up.  I followed everything you and Joe told me to do to a T.  As Joe mentioned when analyzing where my partition started.  "It certainly looks to me like the partition starts at sector 63.  (Although it seems offset a bit from where I'm used to seeing the "ReIsEf2Fs" string.)"

 

Again as I mentioned, relying solely on the community which at times can provide bad information and/or limited understanding of the inner workings of unraid, is what I would expect from a free software solution.  Not something I paid $120 for a license and then expect to recieve zero end user support.

so why escalate the negativity by returning the sentiment? 

 

I replied, to the sentence I quoted, to say that when seeking help from volunteers, you do not need "a submissive stance" (just civility) & explained myself. My response was to enlighten, not escalate.

 

Posting here is going off-topic (not my intention). Feel free to PM me if you would like to continue discussing.

 

@ the personal(?) note - The help desk is often called hell desk. It is referring to working that level of support & dealing with hostile users. Assisting is only part of tier 1 support. It is also part of tier 1 to deal with tier 2 & up in a better manner so that the higher tiers don't have to directly deal with aggressive users.

I only had one disk actually go bad (disk 11) when I went to have it rebuilt by parity all my 2TB drives became seen as unformatted by unraid.

 

Yes, but many people have had the partitioning changed and corrected it using the methods outlined in some threads I listed without it becoming a data loss issue. However, in your case the file system on the disks did not match anything unRAID normally creates. At that point, my guess was that you did something odd to the disks that you conveniently didn't mention and I could not help further so I didn't respond again.

 

Overall, the worste cases occur when someone makes a small issue bigger by going off in a panic and randomly trying to fix it by doing things in different randon orders hoping something good happens - starting/stopping/un-assigning/assigning/moving/formatting/initconf - instead of stopping and assessing the issue and possibly getting help so they can create a plan for recovery.

 

 

Lionel, you are completely wrong.  When I first had a problem with my server I left it off and didn't touch it for a week so I didn't try and panic and screw something up.  I followed everything you and Joe told me to do to a T.  As Joe mentioned when analyzing where my partition started.  "It certainly looks to me like the partition starts at sector 63.  (Although it seems offset a bit from where I'm used to seeing the "ReIsEf2Fs" string.)"

 

Just to be clear, the second paragraph wasn't directed to your failures.

 

As for your partitioning. I have no explanation for it. I've seen the data those commands produce and even looked at my disks and yours doesn't match how unRAID partitions the and formats the disks. So, I can't help you since I have no clue how your disks got that way or how to return them to a format unRAID will recognize. Anything more I could recommend would be a guess and the results are upredictable. Basically, all I could say is to first put the partitions back to what you expect is correct. Second, let unRAID rebuild the failed drive despite the unformatted drives. Third, runs reiserfsck -scan-whole-partition on each drive in an attempt to find any files and restore them. Lastly, sort through the contents that result and see what you get.

 

 

I've been using unRAID since the very beginning, since Tom used to mail out hardware to users as license keys. I've had more than one drive failure that was recovered with ease. I have had to work with Tom offline a couple of times to include at LEAST 3 USB dongles that have failed. I have also watched the community freak out whenever Tom went missing for periods of time to take care of his personal life. Through it all my systems have continued to run just fine and Tom has always responded quickly to my pleas for help regarding my failed dongles. Only once have I ever lost any data, a power failure managed to slightly corrupt a ReiserFS drive. I've been more careful and use a UPS now. The community has always been extremely helpful and I've tried to give back where I've been able.

 

I'm sorry if the software hasn't worked out for someone, truly, but for the vast majority of users it has. For the majority of us it continues to function well and serve its primary purpose. The reason you get the reaction you do when you're critical is because so many have had such success and it offends us when you throw stones. <shrug>

 

P.s. I should add, expect to also find people with whatever alternate package you choose who are just as ticked. I bet more than one has actually moved TO unRAID! I know for a fact at least one or two Drobo user has...

I'm uncomfortable with the situation.  My unraid server is a critical component to my home it infrastructure and I need to be ale to sleep at nights knowing that if shit does hit the fan, I will have support.

 

While I appreciate and respect the long term knowledgable users that are providing the bulk of the support, I'm not sure it's enough for me.  I need to know the company I bought the product off provides support for the product they sell. Even the user community who provide support when defending Tom seem to use a faith based argument.  Have faith in unraid, it won't let you down.  I'm not religious in my tech so faith can't come into any tech decision made.

 

The lack of follow up, missed deadlines without even a note to the community as to why.  The glib sporadic one line posts in this forum that seem just as intent to taunt his detractors as they are to inform the community of various things don't add any confidence either.

 

I like the product but it doesn't make me feel safe.  If I used the server just for no critical data then I'd worry less.  Could another solution I feel better with for critical data, I think so, but I'm ot keen to run multiple storage devices at home.

 

I'm now looking for alternatives to unraid.  Not because its failed me but because I fear what happens when it does. With two young kids who demand attention. Don't have the free time to tinker and play with my tech  the way I did when I was single.

 

It's a shame.  I don't think it would take that much from Tom to change the perception that's he's a one man band who avoids his paying customers unless they are bung a new license.  Whether that is reality or not doesn't really matter, it's the perception that counts.

I used unraid 4.7 for a year without issue.  Then about a year ago I lost 4TB of semi-replaceable data due to Extremely poor support from Tom at Lime tech.  I would have lost ZERO data if Tom had provided an adequate level of support.

...

 

Scott, I count 40 email send/replies between us from 3/1/2012 thru 3/21/2012.  Your last email said this:

 

Well I'm just going to pull my data off disk6 and replace it then.  That way I only end up losing 2TB of data instead of 4TB.

 

Yes this was a very strange problem involving bad h/w at the essence, though to be honest I don't remember all the details of this converation and I don't really want to go back and read all the emails.  I don't think it's fair to say you received "Extremely poor support".

I'm uncomfortable with the situation.  My unraid server is a critical component to my home it infrastructure and I need to be ale to sleep at nights knowing that if shit does hit the fan, I will have support.

 

While I appreciate and respect the long term knowledgable users that are providing the bulk of the support, I'm not sure it's enough for me.  I need to know the company I bought the product off provides support for the product they sell. Even the user community who provide support when defending Tom seem to use a faith based argument.  Have faith in unraid, it won't let you down.  I'm not religious in my tech so faith can't come into any tech decision made.

 

The lack of follow up, missed deadlines without even a note to the community as to why.  The glib sporadic one line posts in this forum that seem just as intent to taunt his detractors as they are to inform the community of various things don't add any confidence either.

 

I like the product but it doesn't make me feel safe.  If I used the server just for no critical data then I'd worry less.  Could another solution I feel better with for critical data, I think so, but I'm ot keen to run multiple storage devices at home.

 

I'm now looking for alternatives to unraid.  Not because its failed me but because I fear what happens when it does. With two young kids who demand attention. Don't have the free time to tinker and play with my tech  the way I did when I was single.

 

It's a shame.  I don't think it would take that much from Tom to change the perception that's he's a one man band who avoids his paying customers unless they are bung a new license.  Whether that is reality or not doesn't really matter, it's the perception that counts.

 

Most people have this "faith" because the product has served them well for years - myself included. I don't load up a ton of extra "stuff" on my unRAID (although I do virtualize it now) and thus run into few of the issues others may. It simply works and has for something like 5++ years at least. Is it really faith if a product demonstrates that it works? My previous servers used to go as long as 6 months between boots and my current one has multiple weeks on it too, it's not something that pulls my attention from larger things in life. If anything this forum pulls more attention from me than my actual running of the software!