Thoughts on Lian-Li PC-Q25B Builds


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Here you go! So much more room for activities!

 

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Specs for those that love to read:

5x4tb HGST Coolspin yielding 16TB raw storage

500gb Samsung Evo 850 cache SSD

unRAID server as the OS

Gigabyte GTX 1070 G1 Gaming passed through to a Windows 10 VM for gaming

Intel i5-4430 with Noctua L9i HSF

Asus H87I-Plus Mini-ITX

16gb Crucial DDR3 RAM

Lian Li Q25B case with Fractal Design HF14 and HF12 intake/exhaust fans

Corsair SF450 PSU

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The front fan on mine lost a blade and by the time I got a new fan another blade dropped. Didn't seem to bother the fan at all, being all broken, but you should check your fans, they seem to be made of brittle plastic.

 

Many pages back in this thread we were talking about dimming the blue case light with a potentiometer and I tried that on another Lian Li build. I used a 5k ohm and it didn't dim it enough, I need more ohms to make the light dark. My thinking was to use one sized to the range needed so you had control over the full range of adjustment, as opposed to having one where you go from light to dark in 1/8 of a turn. 10k might do it but we'll see on my next build.

 

Speaking of next builds...

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I wanted to build a backup server for my 2 year old build>>>

 

Original Unraid NAS Build

 

After thinking about this I've realized that the old build is going to be the backup and I am going to build a new server. I love the build but today I'd use 8TB drives for a potential 40TB machine, and I have a lot more junk on my daily driver than what needs to actually be backed up.

 

Of the things I need to know the easiest question to ask is what 8TB drives would you buy? The HGSTs run HOT, and I just don't want to use them again. I'm inclined to buy the WD Red 8TB drives, unless there is some problem with them. I did see Seagate had some new type of drive that might be an option but I'd need to be schooled if that is a good idea. I'm not a fan of Seagate though.

 

Ok, the complicated part. I don't transcode or have VMs or use any major add ons, nor do I expect to in the next 2 years. I am inclined to go with the same sort of Motherboard/CPU/Mem, (non-server grade), in modern options, but I would like to use the right parts that will allow me to fiddle with VMs if I have some free time. Does that make sense?

 

 

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... what 8TB drives would you buy?

...

 

From a price perspective, the Seagate SMR's are the best deal, and the shingled technology doesn't seem to have a significant impact in most UnRAID use cases.    But the WD Reds are definitely better drives -- helium sealed, PMR units with superb performance.    I just installed 5 of them in a new desktop I built last month and am VERY happy with their performance.

 

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...

Ok, the complicated part. I don't transcode or have VMs or use any major add ons, nor do I expect to in the next 2 years. I am inclined to go with the same sort of Motherboard/CPU/Mem, (non-server grade), in modern options, but I would like to use the right parts that will allow me to fiddle with VMs if I have some free time. Does that make sense?

 

I'd be far more inclined to use server-grade hardware ... for a fault-tolerant server I want fault-tolerant memory!  If I was building a new mini-ITX system today, I'd use this motherboard:  http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813599009

 

... with a Xeon and a pair of 16GB ECC memory modules.

 

That would be VERY future-proof, and would give you plenty of memory to "fiddle" with VM's.    [A pair of 8GB modules would give you enough to "fiddle" if you don't want to spring for 32GB]

 

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Thank you Gary, that's exactly what I needed. I wanted graphics so I went with the Xeon E3-1245V5, which is middle of the road I guess. The parts so far are here, and I'm hoping I've got everything right >>>

 

New Unraid NAS

 

I ordered the memory from Kingston and they say it will be available 7/1, (which I'll believe when I see it). You had linked to these before >>>

 

Newegg.com/Product=Kingston ValueRAM 32GB

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...

Ok, the complicated part. I don't transcode or have VMs or use any major add ons, nor do I expect to in the next 2 years. I am inclined to go with the same sort of Motherboard/CPU/Mem, (non-server grade), in modern options, but I would like to use the right parts that will allow me to fiddle with VMs if I have some free time. Does that make sense?

 

I'd be far more inclined to use server-grade hardware ... for a fault-tolerant server I want fault-tolerant memory!  If I was building a new mini-ITX system today, I'd use this motherboard:  http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813599009

 

... with a Xeon and a pair of 16GB ECC memory modules.

 

That would be VERY future-proof, and would give you plenty of memory to "fiddle" with VM's.    [A pair of 8GB modules would give you enough to "fiddle" if you don't want to spring for 32GB]

+1. I'd pair it with a hyper threaded E3-1230 v5. Really need that 32gb RAM and dual ethernet! I just don't have $600 to chuck about for the mobo/cpu/ram.

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Which HGST? the He8? Mine doesn't run hot. It's comparable to my WD Black 6TB and the Seagate NAS 8TB (i.e. not the SMR version). Within 1-2 degrees diff, it can simply be explained by different position in the cage.

 

If I were to upgrade my old 3TB and 4TB right now, I would opt for the Seagate NAS but it's because 7200rpm is important for me.

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Thank you Gary, that's exactly what I needed. I wanted graphics so I went with the Xeon E3-1245V5, which is middle of the road I guess. The parts so far are here, and I'm hoping I've got everything right >>>

 

New Unraid NAS

 

I ordered the memory from Kingston and they say it will be available 7/1, (which I'll believe when I see it). You had linked to these before >>>

 

Newegg.com/Product=Kingston ValueRAM 32GB

 

Hi, do you know if using the Xeon with onboard graphics allows you to pass it through in a VM for something like openelec?

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Which HGST? the He8? Mine doesn't run hot. It's comparable to my WD Black 6TB and the Seagate NAS 8TB (i.e. not the SMR version). Within 1-2 degrees diff, it can simply be explained by different position in the cage.

 

If I were to upgrade my old 3TB and 4TB right now, I would opt for the Seagate NAS but it's because 7200rpm is important for me.

 

I had a link to my first build on Parts Picker >>> Unraid NAS

 

I used 3 HGST Deskstar NAS 6TB drives and 3 WD Red 4TB drives. The HGSTs all run upper 40's, and I have seen >50, while the Reds might occasionally run just over 40. It isn't quite a 10 degree difference but I wouldn't want to fill up a small case with the HGSTs that I used.

 

The HGSTs are 7200 rpm drives vs the Reds @ 5400 rpm, so I suppose that accounts for much of the heat difference.

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Thank you Gary, that's exactly what I needed. I wanted graphics so I went with the Xeon E3-1245V5, which is middle of the road I guess. The parts so far are here, and I'm hoping I've got everything right >>>

 

New Unraid NAS

 

I ordered the memory from Kingston and they say it will be available 7/1, (which I'll believe when I see it). You had linked to these before >>>

 

Newegg.com/Product=Kingston ValueRAM 32GB

 

Hi, do you know if using the Xeon with onboard graphics allows you to pass it through in a VM for something like openelec?

 

I hope you don't think asking me a technical question is a good idea, but I doubt CPU graphics has anything to do with pass thru. I just want the ability to use the motherboard graphics to hook a monitor up to the console.

 

<edit> I totally misunderstood your question, if you are hoping to pass thru the CPU graphics you should find someone that has done that already with the hardware you want to use. 

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Lian-Li has announced a slightly larger Q25 case called the M25... looks interesting!

 

http://www.tweaktown.com/pressrelease/10496/lian-li-announces-pc-m25-chassis-plethora-drive-mounts/index.html

 

Things have changed since I built my Q25, and with all of the potential of V6 I can't help but think this M25 is the new best case for a small tidy Unraid build. I could be wrong but it certainly is in the ballpark.

 

At the very least I don't want to go forward with just 1 PCI slot, and this M25 case is just 1 1/2" taller and 3" deeper than the Q25. I love my Q25 build but I want more expansion than the Q25 case allows for when I buy new parts.

 

I feel like a traitor but I think it is best to move to a mATX board.

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Agree -- the M25 is a VERY nice alternative for a small system with a bit more expandability than a Q-25B based unit.

 

I've used it one time (for a friend) ... but it took about 2 months to get one, as they were very hard to find.  First tried to buy it in Feb, but didn't get the case until May.    I see they're now available again on Newegg.

 

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Lian-Li has announced a slightly larger Q25 case called the M25... looks interesting!

 

http://www.tweaktown.com/pressrelease/10496/lian-li-announces-pc-m25-chassis-plethora-drive-mounts/index.html

 

Things have changed since I built my Q25, and with all of the potential of V6 I can't help but think this M25 is the new best case for a small tidy Unraid build. I could be wrong but it certainly is in the ballpark.

 

At the very least I don't want to go forward with just 1 PCI slot, and this M25 case is just 1 1/2" taller and 3" deeper than the Q25. I love my Q25 build but I want more expansion than the Q25 case allows for when I buy new parts.

 

I feel like a traitor but I think it is best to move to a mATX board.

 

I've been in the same boat recently. The want for 32gb RAM and an extra PCIe slot for a quad gigabit NIC is enticing!

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  • 5 weeks later...

Hoping for some help with a new Q25B build:

 

Upgrading by current unraid box in a Q08B which is using the SUPERMICRO MBD-X7SPA-HF-O Mini ITX with Atom D510 processor.

 

Use case is for storage plus probably ~5 dockers, most intense being plex (max 2-3 streams).  No VMs. 

 

Already have the drives from my current array, need help selecting cost-effective but ample motherboard/processor/memory and an SSD cache drive for the dockers.  All the examples of recent builds I've found seem like overkill for my purposes and I'm looking to not spend more than necessary to cover my bases.

 

Any thoughts would be much appreciated, thanks!

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Hoping for some help with a new Q25B build:

 

Upgrading by current unraid box in a Q08B which is using the SUPERMICRO MBD-X7SPA-HF-O Mini ITX with Atom D510 processor.

 

Use case is for storage plus probably ~5 dockers, most intense being plex (max 2-3 streams).  No VMs. 

 

Already have the drives from my current array, need help selecting cost-effective but ample motherboard/processor/memory and an SSD cache drive for the dockers.  All the examples of recent builds I've found seem like overkill for my purposes and I'm looking to not spend more than necessary to cover my bases.

 

Any thoughts would be much appreciated, thanks!

 

If those 2-3 Plex streams are to be transcoded streams then you want a processor with at least 7,000 passmarks (2k per stream + 1k for unRAID proper).

 

If I were to build a new Q25 today my specs would be 16GB w/ an i5-6400/6500. Motherboard doesnt really matter so long as you stick with the main brands and it has the SATA port count you want.

 

You'd be ok with 8GB ram, I would go with 16GB since I run a couple of small VM's but allocating RAM to them can make 8GB go pretty quickly.

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Thanks for your thoughts. If I ditched plex and the most CPU intensive activity was unpacking archives, what specs do you think I could get away with?

 

Anything from current or previous gen intel would work. I ran unRAID w/o Plex on 2GB and a Celeron G1840 for quite some time.. check my sig for original system specs and my Q25 build.

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Hoping for some help with a new Q25B build:

 

Upgrading by current unraid box in a Q08B which is using the SUPERMICRO MBD-X7SPA-HF-O Mini ITX with Atom D510 processor.

 

Use case is for storage plus probably ~5 dockers, most intense being plex (max 2-3 streams).  No VMs. 

 

Already have the drives from my current array, need help selecting cost-effective but ample motherboard/processor/memory and an SSD cache drive for the dockers.  All the examples of recent builds I've found seem like overkill for my purposes and I'm looking to not spend more than necessary to cover my bases.

 

Any thoughts would be much appreciated, thanks!

 

A few thoughts ...

 

=> There's really no reason to move from the Q08 to a Q25B.  Both easily hold 7 3.5" drives ... with the Q08 there are 6 3.5" slots plus you can put one in the 5.25" bay;  with the Q25B there are 5 hot-swap bays and you can put 2 on bottom plate.  It's possible, using spacers, to add a couple more on the bottom of the Q25, but unless you plan to do that, there's no real reason to switch cases unless it's worth it to you for the easier drive-swap capability.  I DO like the nice "pop-off" side panel on the Q25B a lot more than the tiny screws you have to remove on the Q08, but they're both very nice cases.    I've used the Q08 for several desktop PC builds.

 

=>  Your current D510 build is an exellent unit for NAS-only usage; but I agree you need more "horsepower" for Dockers and Plex.    If price isn't the sole consideration, I'd use a server class motherboard and a CPU that supports ECC [Current gen i3 or Xeon E3].    This is a good choice:  http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813599009

[Although Newegg doesn't show it, it DOES support Skylake i3/5/7 CPUs if you don't want to use a Xeon -- but I'd at least use ECC RAM and a CPU with ECC support - either an i3 or a Xeon E3]  Note that if you use a Xeon you need to get one that has built-in graphics (all of the Skylake i3's do; but not all Xeons do).

 

Note that this upgrade will make a HUGE increase in your CPU "horsepower" => your Atom D510 scores 654 on PassMark;  a low-end Core i3-6100 scores  5330, and the E3 Xeons can double that.    You'll not only have PLENTY of power for Dockers and a couple Plex streams, but if you should later decide to run a VM or two you can easily do so.    You could save a few $$ by using a Pentium G4400, which still has ECC support and scores a respectable 3676 on PassMark, but for ~ $50 difference I'd go with the i3-6100 just for "insurance", primarily in case you want to run an extra Plex stream, but also for a bit more "horsepower" if you ever use a VM.  Both support both vt-x and vt-d, so they'll work fine with VM's, should you ever decide to add one.

 

I do agree that the i3 is "overkill" for your stated needs; and the G4400 is really plenty.  Only you can decide if bumping up to an i3 feels like you'd be spending "... more than necessary to cover my bases ..." or is simply good insurance against possible increasing demands on the system in the future.

 

One other thought:  You apparently aren't running dual parity, but if you should decide to do so, the CPU demands of the 2nd parity calculation are significantly higher than with single parity.  Any modern CPU (including the G4400) won't have an issue with that; but I suspect your D510 would struggle a bit (it would work fine; you'd just have slower parity checks and drive rebuilds).    But IF you have no plans to move to dual parity, one other alternative would be to simply leave your system as-is for your NAS use, and build a small 2nd server for your apps.  This wouldn't be any cheaper -- in fact it'd probably cost more, since you'd not only need a new motherboard, CPU, memory, but also a new case and PSU -- but depending on where you want to locate the systems might let you use an even smaller case.  Perhaps something like http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811112424

 

... OR, if your 2nd system doesn't need to be an UnRAID box you could even use a NUC, which is a REALLY nifty little system [i've configured a couple of these in the past few months, and they're VERY nice systems -- in a 4" x 4" x 1.5" box !! => e.g. this little guy scores 3504 on PassMark:  http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16856102146&cm_re=Intel_NUC-_-56-102-146-_-Product ]

 

Bottom line:  Your best choice is probably to simply upgrade your current motherboard/CPU/memory to a current generation Intel setup ... I'd spring for the server-class board so you can use ECC RAM and get either the Pentium G4400 or the i3-6100.    That will let you setup the Dockers you want; easily support 2 or 3 Plex streams (especially with the i3); and will even have enough "horsepower" to support a VM if you should ever decide to go that route.    For what you've outlined, 8GB would be plenty of RAM, but you may want to go with 16GB for a bit more "headroom" for the future.    Simply get a pair of either these:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820242154

or these:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820242165

 

 

 

 

 

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  • 3 weeks later...

Thank you Gary, that's exactly what I needed. I wanted graphics so I went with the Xeon E3-1245V5, which is middle of the road I guess. The parts so far are here, and I'm hoping I've got everything right >>>

 

New Unraid NAS

 

I ordered the memory from Kingston and they say it will be available 7/1, (which I'll believe when I see it). You had linked to these before >>>

 

Newegg.com/Product=Kingston ValueRAM 32GB

 

Qtrmeg,

 

Did you build this unit?  If, so are you happy with it?  I am looking at building a replacement server with the same parts, but with the PC-M25 case.

 

Thanks, srengr.

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Being in the tropics with no air on where the river is, my drives idled low 40s and hit 60 on parity checks.  The Q25 was just too small.

 

I migrated to a Fractal Node 804 and what a difference.  Low 30 idles, low forty parity.  And the room to work is nice.

 

It's about the same height as a Q25 but wider.  A cube.  If you have the extra width people should consider it as a wider alternative.

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