Q&A with Tom on unRAID® Virtualization


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I'm having some troubles with this picture:

 

unRAID-withVR.jpg

 

Apparantly, you could replace all the separate (media) pc's with one unraid server, using virtualization.

But... those separate pc's usually are located at different physical locations. The xbmc pc e.g. is connected to the tv in the bedroom, the windows media pc in the livingroom, connected to the tv there, both with HDMI cables.

 

Now the picture shows us that those 2 machines could be replaced by 1 unraid platform running some virtual machines, that is fine. But how do i connect more than 1 tv to this server? In a way that tv1, that is in the bedroom, shows xbmc, and the other tv shows windows media center? Do i have to add multiple video cards to the unraid server? Is that even possible?

 

Furthermore, if i replace those specific pc's with virtual ones, i need HDMI cables up to 100ft, since my unraid machine is located in the basement :) or... i have to place my unraid server in the livingroom? And i don't want something that sounds like a small vacuum cleaner, in my livingroom...

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I think the idea is to show what is indeed possible. 

 

As to what to do with 2+ HDMI ports coming out of a single computer the answer could be to use an hdmi matrix switch which would then let you choose what signal to send to what TV (http://www.hdtvsupply.com/4x4-hdmi-matrix-switchers.html).  And HDMI cables can be pretty long.  I have a buddy who does this. Not with unraid VM's and multiple video cards, but with multiple sources in a comm closet and a 4x4 hdmi matrix to send any source to any TV.

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Yes you would use video cards with passthrough. You could send the hdmi over Ethernet if you have 2x cables from your server to the tv. The problem I have is sending the remote over USB since I hate phone remotes :)

 

RF remote......? (ie Harmony) or CEC (working in Openelec AFAIK, not sure if this works with anything else)

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From what I gather from the blog is once 6.0 is out of beta it will ship with XEN and you can do a virtual environment  if you choose to and have the equipment that can handle it.

 

My question is this, will it still be a free download for up to 3 drives, will current members be allow to upgrade and used their current license? Will is still need to boot of a usb?

 

 

 

 

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excellent, now i kinda wish i did not have some much on my array and start fresh.

So jump on the $30 for an extra key, and when you have time / money build another box. Drive sizes and media accumulation for many users mean you need the equivalent of a new server every few years anyway, so leave your current server intact and build a new one from scratch the way you want it.
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Furthermore, if i replace those specific pc's with virtual ones, i need HDMI cables up to 100ft, since my unraid machine is located in the basement :) or... i have to place my unraid server in the livingroom? And i don't want something that sounds like a small vacuum cleaner, in my livingroom...

 

That's my plan. I'm fortunate in that where my server is positioned in my attic, I have a run of not more that 15M to my Living Room TV, Family Room TV and Home Theatre. HDMI and USB run to each location should give me video, sound and remote control for each screen AND both unRAID and a TV Server running in the box at the same time.

 

Loving the consolidation capabilities this gives us.

 

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Yes to all three. Will be the same as going from 4.7 to 5

 

Ashe does not speak for Lime Technology; this has not been determined.

 

I stand corrected, had not seen any discussion on this? Would prefer if this could be an open topic with the community before any decision is made

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Yes to all three. Will be the same as going from 4.7 to 5

 

Ashe does not speak for Lime Technology; this has not been determined.

 

I have no issues with having to pay a premium if and when this is release and it's stable. 

 

I can get VMware cluster going now and know I have stability but I like the way I can expand with unRaid.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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Mixed opinion at the moment, have to wait for further releases.

 

While virtualisation is a lot more stable and flexible, If you don't have vt-x capable hardware then apart from the 64-bit addition, you can do the same in 5 as you can in 6 (depending on what else is coming out in 6) by using vbox

 

Disk images have been greatly assisted by the community so far.

 

 

 

 

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Mixed opinion at the moment, have to wait for further releases.

 

While virtualisation is a lot more stable and flexible, If you don't have vt-x capable hardware then apart from the 64-bit addition, you can do the same in 5 as you can in 6 (depending on what else is coming out in 6) by using vbox

 

Disk images have been greatly assisted by the community so far.

 

well the difference is that in v5 you have to use type 2 hypervisor which is in it self a ported plug-in and not a  native app.

where in v6 you are running natively  baremetal type1 HV

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Yes to all three. Will be the same as going from 4.7 to 5

 

Ashe does not speak for Lime Technology; this has not been determined.

 

I stand corrected, had not seen any discussion on this? Would prefer if this could be an open topic with the community before any decision is made

 

I didn't mean to cause this thread to go off-topic.  I was just pointing out that Ashe has no special insight to design/business decisions we make.  I probably should have moved the post to the bilge instead.  Rest assured that no matter if anything changes, current key holders will not be affected.

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  • 2 weeks later...

Wow, I'm late to the party but totally stoked. There are 2 servers in my closet right now, Unraid, and a Dell poweredge with kvm running a half dozen VMs.

 

Tom's illustration of an Unraid/Xen setup in the blog is exactly what I've been planning for my server/media appliances when I finish my house over the next year. One 'house server' running unraid, various VMS for subsonic/owncloud etc... and one or two XBMC instances attatched to video cards and HDMI over cat5 extenders. I can't wait to buy new hardware :)

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unRAID-withVR.jpg

 

very hard is passthroug GPU ... i was testing few grafic cards (AMD, NVidia) - VMware Esix 5.0-5.5

i try run Openelec virtual build with grafic driver AMD, NVIDIA and there are many issue include problem with sound which you cannot redirect,

or glitching

Im also try on Windows there is better effect but still for me this is to much unstable.

 

Just read forums about passthroug GPU maybe only few person successful run this example for gaming.

For more simple task like for mining some crypto-coins when you dont need sound or picture on TV, is more easy.

 

For me solution with passthroug GPU need 2years + before this will be work like should be and will be more compaible with

vendors of mb, gpu etc.

 

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I know several people that have had the same experience where the theory of passing through a GPU didn't match the practice.

 

I would suggest that if this is the future we make sure we have a support kit list for people to choose from

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tl;dr: I don't get the appeal of GPU pass-thru.  The time, money, and effort to get GPU pass-thru seems wasted when a server/thin-client setup can cost the same and provides more flexibility and features.

 

Full Version:

I know everyone has different use cases but I gotta say I simply do not understand the desire to collocate a data server and HTPC.  Small, cheap, quiet in a dataarray+HTPC just seems like a quixotic endeavor if for no other reason than size will be dictated by the drives, and if you crowd them all together you'll need lots of airflow and a small crowded case makes it hard to keep the CPU cool as well. 

 

All the effort to get workable GPU pass-thru, with the right card (A few $$$ for a compatible one vs. the bare min for console or even headless), and the right motherboard (a bit of a $$$ premium) and the right CPU (also a $$$ premium) seems counter productive to just building a dedicated dataserver to serve up media to some thin clients.  The server can be built with low cost hardware, a reasonable case, quiet fans, and be tucked away either in a basement, closet, or far corner of a single room apartment AWAY from the TV and maybe even shielded from sight and sound by an end table or a bookcase.

 

A RaspberryPi, Roku, NUC, or even a low cost HTPC (http://forum.xbmc.org/showthread.php?tid=94199%5Dhttp://forum.xbmc.org/showthread.php?tid=94199) coupled with Plex or XBMC w/ centralized DB will give so much more flexibility and capability all without the struggle of figuring out how to do GPU pass-thru which gains you exactly one video stream per GPU (and more GPUs means bigger MB and bigger case).  Sure you can use that GPU-pass-thru box to also serve media to thin clients/remotely but you are still left with the trade-off question of: spend time and money to add GPU pass-thru to an UnRaid server, or spend time and money buying and setting up one/one-more thin client.

 

If you spend more than a $50 premium to get GPU passthru, you're wasting money that could have been spent on a Roku or RaspberryPi to run Plex or XBMC/OpenElec.  If you have a need for more robust media playback (like ISO, m2ts, rar, etc) then for $250 you can have a small, quiet, but powerful HTPC do that work while your server does its job serving up media to include a VM running Plex which will let you watch your media remotely on your phone or share your library with friends and family (I think XBMC can do that too but I can't be sure).

 

Like I said I know some people might really have a use case where GPU pass-thru solves some problem I have not thought of, or might be cheaper because they already have most of the required parts, but I just can't help but think of the above everytime I read about people wanting GPU pass-thru for their home theater needs.

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I know where your coming from Alex and in some/a lot cases that's the correct system (server and then clients).

 

But as you can see enough people are interested in VM's for it to be included in the next version of unraid.  Not all hardware will support Gpu passthrough but if you already have it then there is no additional cost aside from the card which doesn't have to be highend for Htpc tasks.  So in that situation you get the power of a multi core sever,  all you have to do is add a card and get video to your TV.  In that case it's cheaper then a NUC and way more powerful than a pi.  Of course getting the video to you TV may or may not be challenging.  But in some cases a dedicated server/hardware room with Gpu for each room with just a wire is a lot more clean,  efficient etc.  But yes it's probably a small portion of users that are going to that extent. But I think you would be surprised how many would go down this route if the above issues mentioned with actually making this happen,  as apposed to theory,  were gone.  There are also miners but that's probably a very small user base.

 

Sent from my SM-N900W8 using Tapatalk

 

 

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Well yeah I'm not a fan of the Pi anyway for HTPC.  I know people get it to work smooth, I never have.  But the Roku really is an amazing solution when coupled with Plex and quite inexpensive.  But I know the UI isn't to everyone's liking.  Hence why I even mentuioned the Rpi or a small dedicated HTPC.

 

[snark] Miners ... hahaha, mining on an unraid server ... hahaha ... and trying to be "cost efficient" ... hahahahahah [/snark]  :)

 

I'd still say someone with the time, money, and motivation to put a multi-gpu HTPC/Unraid server together in a server-room coupled with long HDMI runs or using hdmi-over-cat5 is still better served (get it hehe) by decoupling their unraid and HTPC server.

 

I mean sure I'm not suggesting GPU pass-thru shouldn't happen, I'm just saying for the purposes of most HTPC people, there are better options out there than beating their heads against the pass-thru wall when they don't need to. 

 

Anyway, clearly it should happen and I was just bored at work ;-)

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