brettm357 Posted September 30, 2014 Share Posted September 30, 2014 What is the Number one program at the moment for backing up Unraid Files to an external hard drive plugged into a Windows machine - Currently running Unraid 6 Beta 10a Quote Link to comment
ntrlsur Posted September 30, 2014 Share Posted September 30, 2014 Which unraid files are you talking about? The data on the flash stick or something else? Quote Link to comment
garycase Posted September 30, 2014 Share Posted September 30, 2014 If your files all fit on a single external drive, I'd use SyncBack. (the free version is fine) http://www.2brightsparks.com/freeware/freeware-hub.html?gclid=CN-n5b2OisECFUoF7AodYXgAZQ Quote Link to comment
brettm357 Posted October 1, 2014 Author Share Posted October 1, 2014 The files im talking about are Movies, photos etc Quote Link to comment
nxtiak Posted October 1, 2014 Share Posted October 1, 2014 If you want to back up your unRAID server into an external hard drive, doesn't sound like your unRAID server is big at all..... Just plug it in and copy/paste the files or use SyncToy or some other copying program. Why have unRAID at all if all your stuff fits on an external drive? Just buy multiple externals and keep them in sync. Cheaper. An unRAID is already backed up. If a drive crashes, pop in a new drive and it will rebuild the lost data. (As long as you have your unRAID setup properly with a parity drive) Quote Link to comment
bkastner Posted October 1, 2014 Share Posted October 1, 2014 Or, since you are starting with a small amount of data you could look at CrashPlan, which would sync to the cloud. When you have TB of data it can get unwieldy, but if you are starting when you are small it may work as a solution for you. Quote Link to comment
tr0910 Posted October 1, 2014 Share Posted October 1, 2014 An unRAID is already backed up. If a drive crashes, pop in a new drive and it will rebuild the lost data. (As long as you have your unRAID setup properly with a parity drive) No unRaid is not backup. Yes it is mildly fault tolerant of one hard disk failure, but real backup it is not. Real backup will survive user error (oops I didn't mean to delete all of the pictures of our wedding). This is the deadliest of all errors. It will survive fire flood and theft. It will survive nuclear strike and other less common ills. UnRaid is not backup. Edit Let me add that I use a 2nd unRaid server as backup. It is basically a twin of my main box only missing 3 drives that are only for temp working files and don't need to be backed up. And the real critical files are CrashPlanned to the cloud. Quote Link to comment
brettm357 Posted October 1, 2014 Author Share Posted October 1, 2014 I currently have 5TB of data and would like to back up to 2 External 4TB hard drives - To cover myself against fire, theft accidental deletion - I understand unraid is not a backup which is why I am looking for options Quote Link to comment
garycase Posted October 1, 2014 Share Posted October 1, 2014 ... An unRAID is already backed up. ... NO !! No RAID system is a substitute for backups. UnRAID provides fault tolerance, but as with any other system you can still lose data. Any data you don't want to lose should be backed up! Quote Link to comment
garycase Posted October 1, 2014 Share Posted October 1, 2014 I currently have 5TB of data and would like to back up to 2 External 4TB hard drives - To cover myself against fire, theft accidental deletion - I understand unraid is not a backup which is why I am looking for options With modern 6TB drives you can backup to a single external drive. However, as your data grows, that will become inadequate. There are a couple easy ways to set up backups when you have more data than fits on a single drive: (1) The simplest is to set up a 2nd UnRAID server and simply populate it with enough drives to provide enough capacity for a full backup. This can be a very low cost motherboard/CPU, since it's purely used as a NAS, with no add-ons, etc. In fact (although I don't recommend it), you could even omit using a parity drive for this, since the primary UnRAID is already fault tolerant. Then you can use a sync utility to simply replicate the entire UnRAID server using the share references. (2) If you'd prefer to stay with simple external drives, then buy as many of these as you need (you can more later as needed); and set up backup profiles in SyncBack to backup the individual drives on UnRAID (using the drive references instead of Share references) to the external units. You can match UnRAID's configuration drive for drive; or you may want to backup 2 or more drives to a single external unit, depending on the size of the drives [i.e. 2 2TB drives could be backed up to a single 4TB external unit]. I'd leave all of the require drives connected to the PC -- use a powered hub if you need more USB ports. Quote Link to comment
limetech Posted October 1, 2014 Share Posted October 1, 2014 Respectfully, the blanket statement "unRaid is not a backup solution" is too simplistic. Of course it can be a backup solution. It all depends on what your need is for "backup". I've outlined this before: what I do is have a single dedicated array disk for backup (disk1). This is big enough to store every file I never want to lose, e.g., personal photos and home movies, certain documents like tax returns, and copies of software (such as unraid os source code). This is currently a 3TB hdd. What I do is periodically stop array, yank this drive, replace with different 3TB hdd, then start array and let unraid rebuild. I then take the removed drive and store it off-site. I have a 3 disk rotation set up. Works for me. Actually, all personal photos are stored on my win7 PC because that's where I download and edit them. I then back them up to the unRaid server. So unRaid is indeed a backup solution for these files; just not the only backup solution. In addition, all the other "media" which takes up most of the storage on the array can be re-ripped if necessary from their original physical media. So is the physical media a backup to the unRaid server, or is the unRaid server a backup of the physical media? I guess it depends on who's asking Jon, I believe, has crashplan set up with a buddy and the two of them mirror each other over a vpn. There are many possibilities. Quote Link to comment
garycase Posted October 1, 2014 Share Posted October 1, 2014 Certainly an UnRAID server can be a backup -- in fact, I have one server that's exactly that ... my other two servers are automatically synchronized with the backup every night (serious overkill given the rate of change, but the sync utility doesn't care if it runs daily, weekly, monthly, etc.). In fact, I think the BEST backup of your UnRAID array is indeed simply another UnRAID array ... that way even the backup is fault-tolerant. But an UnRAID server that is the primary storage for data is NOT a backup of that same data. Using the rebuild feature to automatically backup one of the drives is certainly one approach. I'd think a simply sync to a 3TB external would be easier (and safer, since the array could tolerate the failure of another disk during the operation, which it couldn't if it happened during a rebuild). You could use a couple of external drives to do effectively what you're doing now with your rotation. Note it would also be much faster, since a sync would only copy what's new or changed instead of having to rebuild the entire drive. As for whether UnRAID is backing up your media, or your media is backing up UnRAID ... I suspect the answer is neither. Unless your UnRAID files are simply straight rips of your discs, it's likely a pretty labor-intensive effort to recreate your media library. Ripping the DVD, re-rendering it into whatever container format you store them in; possibly re-compressing it to a smaller size; cataloging it; etc. is a lot more effort than just a simple rip. Yes, I could do that with my media discs as well -- and I do have a about a dozen 400 DVD binders full of media as the "ultimate" backups -- but I do NOT ever want to go through that process again, so I maintain a complete set of backups of my UnRAID arrays. The only problem with Jon's approach is a legal one -- clearly they both don't own the original DVDs (at least I assume that's true). I agree, however, that technically it's already a violation (in the US) to simply rip DVDs to your hard disks, although I don't consider that unethical as long as you own all of the original DVDs. I certainly realize that a LOT of UnRAID collections do not include licensed media Quote Link to comment
pkn Posted October 1, 2014 Share Posted October 1, 2014 ... I've outlined this before: what I do is have a single dedicated array disk for backup (disk1). This is big enough to store every file I never want to lose, e.g., personal photos and home movies, certain documents like tax returns, and copies of software (such as unraid os source code). This is currently a 3TB hdd. What I do is periodically stop array, yank this drive, replace with different 3TB hdd, then start array and let unraid rebuild. I then take the removed drive and store it off-site. I have a 3 disk rotation set up. Works for me. ... Great idea. Thanks! ... and now I finally know what I'll store in my bank safe deposit box! Quote Link to comment
ntrlsur Posted October 1, 2014 Share Posted October 1, 2014 Be careful using a bank safe deposit box to store media. Bank vaults and boxes are designed for document and money storage. Electronic media might not fare to well. I use Crashplan to backup home movies / photos and personal information that I have encrypted. I also keep a 2tb external that I backup the same information to giving me 3 copies of the data. 2 are in the same place which I can't avoid due to not having geeky enough friends with enough storage to help me out. Quote Link to comment
JonathanM Posted October 1, 2014 Share Posted October 1, 2014 Be careful using a bank safe deposit box to store media. Bank vaults and boxes are designed for document and money storage. Electronic media might not fare to well.Can you give me an example of a threat would hurt a hard drive in a safe deposit box? I'm drawing a blank. Quote Link to comment
garycase Posted October 1, 2014 Share Posted October 1, 2014 Be careful using a bank safe deposit box to store media. Bank vaults and boxes are designed for document and money storage. Electronic media might not fare to well.Can you give me an example of a threat would hurt a hard drive in a safe deposit box? I'm drawing a blank. Humidity or fire. Safety deposit boxes are generally not humidity controlled as well as a "data proof" safe; nor are they designed to keep temperatures low enough to protect data devices during a fire. Having said that, safety deposit boxes in banks are often in VERY fireproof vaults, so I'd disagree that it's a problem to keep your drives there, as the likelihood of a fire actually entering the vault is VERY low. High-quality data-proof safes are NOT inexpensive. Here are a few 3-hour rated safes: http://www.klsecurity.com/fireking_safe/3-hour-best-fireproof-data-safe.htm ... although you can get some 1-hour rated units for much less: http://www.keystoneoffice.com/safes/phoenix-media-safe-2001.html Quote Link to comment
garycase Posted October 1, 2014 Share Posted October 1, 2014 ... Note that most UL-rated "fire proof" safes are rated to maintain an internal temperature below 350 degree during a 1700 degree fire. Data-rated safes are rated to maintain a temperature no higher than 125 degrees. Quote Link to comment
limetech Posted October 1, 2014 Share Posted October 1, 2014 Be careful using a bank safe deposit box to store media. Bank vaults and boxes are designed for document and money storage. Electronic media might not fare to well.Can you give me an example of a threat would hurt a hard drive in a safe deposit box? I'm drawing a blank. Willie Sutton Quote Link to comment
garycase Posted October 1, 2014 Share Posted October 1, 2014 Be careful using a bank safe deposit box to store media. Bank vaults and boxes are designed for document and money storage. Electronic media might not fare to well.Can you give me an example of a threat would hurt a hard drive in a safe deposit box? I'm drawing a blank. Willie Sutton :) Quote Link to comment
ntrlsur Posted October 1, 2014 Share Posted October 1, 2014 Be careful using a bank safe deposit box to store media. Bank vaults and boxes are designed for document and money storage. Electronic media might not fare to well.Can you give me an example of a threat would hurt a hard drive in a safe deposit box? I'm drawing a blank. Willie Sutton "that's where the money is" Or in this case "that's where the data is" Quote Link to comment
ntrlsur Posted October 1, 2014 Share Posted October 1, 2014 Be careful using a bank safe deposit box to store media. Bank vaults and boxes are designed for document and money storage. Electronic media might not fare to well.Can you give me an example of a threat would hurt a hard drive in a safe deposit box? I'm drawing a blank. One thing that would scare me would be water. While the vault is most likely fireproof / rated its still setup as a regular room with standard sprinkler systems instead of HFC-125 type system. Quote Link to comment
limetech Posted October 1, 2014 Share Posted October 1, 2014 Or in this case "that's where the data is" Could be way more valuable to a criminal than currency! Quote Link to comment
JonathanM Posted October 1, 2014 Share Posted October 1, 2014 Be careful using a bank safe deposit box to store media. Bank vaults and boxes are designed for document and money storage. Electronic media might not fare to well.Can you give me an example of a threat would hurt a hard drive in a safe deposit box? I'm drawing a blank. One thing that would scare me would be water. While the vault is most likely fireproof / rated its still setup as a regular room with standard sprinkler systems instead of HFC-125 type system. Ok, all of the threats listed are just as valid a threat to one degree or another to documents or cash. I was trying to think of a threat that would NOT apply to documents and money, but would apply to a hard drive. Your original statement implied a threat that would be harmless to documents and money, but a significant risk to a hard drive. Quote Link to comment
Brucey7 Posted October 2, 2014 Share Posted October 2, 2014 Be careful using a bank safe deposit box to store media. Bank vaults and boxes are designed for document and money storage. Electronic media might not fare to well.Can you give me an example of a threat would hurt a hard drive in a safe deposit box? I'm drawing a blank. Bonnie & Clyde Quote Link to comment
brettm357 Posted October 2, 2014 Author Share Posted October 2, 2014 Installed SyncBack and its perfect thankyou for your response Quote Link to comment
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