Bob. Would you recommend just using the built in vm manager in unraid then, With the unraid being the most important aspect of the server?

Need a little clarification on your question.  Would I recommend unRAID VM manager over ESXi VM manager?

 

 

ESXi 5.0's manager (VMware vSphere Client) is not web based and unRAIDs manager is.  I've never used ESXi 6.0 but I hear the new manager is web based now as well but not free or at least easily free anyway.  Web based means any platform (linux, mac, windows) can manage the host.  A separate program like what I'm using to manage ESXi 5.0 must have installs for each platform.  So based on that I like unRAID better but ESXi is very stable and has been for a long time for me.  unRAID is newer and it's stability is yet to be proven conclusively to me.  With unRAID 6 beta 5 running XEN VMs were quite stable and reports are that unRAID 6 final with KVM is just as stable as XEN was and why I am thinking about switching.  I do have some KVM VMs running 2 Windows 7 32 bit VMs and have been very stable but are not getting the same tests with tuners and pass through so I cannot go by them until I setup a test VM some time in the next few months.  Whenever I get time I intend on setting up both a docker test of SageTV with a couple of free tuners on HDHRs and a VM running linux version of SageTV and passed through PCIe tuners.  I will also setup a Windows VM for passed through tuners that have no linux drivers and see how the network encoder aspect of the Open Source Version of Sage will work out with all of them. 

Bob, yes that is the question in regards to running Unraid and having it be the most important aspect of the server. Would you recommend running it through ESXi with a VM or two with it or running Unraid natively and using KVM through unraid to run a couple VMs to play around with. The VMs won't really be important to me for function and will only get used on the occasion that there is a specific need or task that needs them briefly. So as long as the stability of the VMs (or instability) doesn't negatively effect the unraid install and the array then I don't have any issues if something were to go wrong with one of the VMs for whatever reason.

Bob, yes that is the question in regards to running Unraid and having it be the most important aspect of the server. Would you recommend running it through ESXi with a VM or two with it or running Unraid natively and using KVM through unraid to run a couple VMs to play around with. The VMs won't really be important to me for function and will only get used on the occasion that there is a specific need or task that needs them briefly. So as long as the stability of the VMs (or instability) doesn't negatively effect the unraid install and the array then I don't have any issues if something were to go wrong with one of the VMs for whatever reason.

At this point I think it is a personal decision.  Both ways have advantages and disadvantages.  For you since you are going to "run a couple VMs to play around with" I would recommend using unRAID native.  Since your VMs are not going to provide a vital function almost as important as your NAS functions there is no need to add another layer between unRAID and the hardware just to provide the virtualization capabilities to play with.

 

 

Bob. Thanks, that is what my thoughts have been on the subject. My thoughts are that since the unraid is the core reason for the whole build that I may as well try to keep it running natively and use the native functions for ease of use and ability upgrade down the road. I'm sure ESXi would work amazingly, but I'm trying to keep it as simple as possible. Now to get my current 5.x.x unraid install upgraded to 6.x.x and start playing around with everything.

 

Do you recommend running windows 10 these days (I know they are going to be charging for updates) or would it be better to run an older version. I have a VM with XP on another system right now (through VMware). It kind of gives an example of my, don't upgrade it unless necessary mentality. I figured since I was going to be going with a new install I could update a little.

... Do you recommend running windows 10 these days (I know they are going to be charging for updates) or would it be better to run an older version.

 

This depends on what you want to use the system ... but FWIW Windows 10 runs very nicely in a VM as well as natively.    And while Microsoft has said that the NEXT version of Windows will be their final version AND will be a subscription model (i.e. have a recurring cost), they do not charge for updates to '10.    The one year "free" period is indeed that -- it's simply a move Microsoft chose to make to get a very high number of installed users off of previous Windows versions.

 

As for which hypervisor to use => I agree that with no critical VM's that you need to have running regardless of the UnRAID status, it's a good choice to just use UnRAID/KVM rather than incurring an additional learning curve with ESXi.

 

Thanks everyone for the help. I think I'll be updating to 6.x.x unraid soon and then getting some VMs going.

The biggest reason for my suggestion to go unRAID instead of ESXi is that is supported.  unRAID on ESXi is not supported and if you have problems help will come from other users or you would likely be told to try it bare metal/unRAID's virtualization and see if the problems still occur.  They facilitate running unRAID in a VM but they don't support it.

 

As to Windows I'm on Win7.  I don't like the subscription model.  Why I'm trying a TRULY free OS like Linux.  If they kept the current model for Windows I would likely upgrade at least one machine to 10+.  I was upgrading when I needed to not because my subscription required me to.  Still have a Vista Desktop.

Bob, I'm with you on the native support through unraid vs the ESXi method. I like that it is supported and it seems they should continue to develop the manager as well and only make it better and more stable. I did read through their blog post on VMs and their goals: http://lime-technology.com/unraid-6-virtualization-update/

 

Hopefully over the next few days or maybe the weekend I will get some time to update to unraid 6.x.x and then I can start looking through some of the guides on getting a VM set up.

 

So windows 10 is the subscription model? If so, then I may just run windows 7.

... So windows 10 is the subscription model? If so, then I may just run windows 7.

 

It's not a subscription model in the sense that you have to pay for it.    But it does automatically install updates and you can't opt out of that feature, like you could in previous Windows versions.    The Home version doesn't let you opt out at all;  the Pro version lets you opt out for a while, but only for a limited time.    Enterprise versions are a bit more flexible.

 

 

Ah...I see. Still think I'll go with 7 then. I like to have control over what's going and I'm pretty sure 7 will be much better suited for the programs than XP since it is so old and I've been starting to see XP isn't supported in some programs anymore.

Agree -- my main desktop is still '7 as well 

It was my understanding (Windows 10) that if you install anything from the store on the free version it will not work after the free year without subscribing to/paying for the Windows updates - or something like that.  In any case if they are not doing it now they appear to be headed that way with Windows.

That's really a bummer. Anything to get more money out of people.

 

Good news, got the unraid install updated to latest version this morning. It was quite simple and took about 30 minutes from shutdown to streaming again. Now I need to get an ssd for the unraid build to put the VMs on.

I don't believe there's any plan to start charging for '10 => but as I understand it the "next" version of Windows will be a subscription model, which will indeed have a recurring charge.

 

Hard to say for sure just what Microsoft has in mind.    Personally, I'll likely be on '7 on my main desktop for a LONG time      But '10 is a nicely done system.

 

 

I don't believe there's any plan to start charging for '10 => but as I understand it the "next" version of Windows will be a subscription model, which will indeed have a recurring charge.

 

Hard to say for sure just what Microsoft has in mind.    Personally, I'll likely be on '7 on my main desktop for a LONG time      But '10 is a nicely done system.

You are correct (of course).  I see where a MS Vise President clarified the poor and misleading wording on the license for Win10.  In the article it had a link to more posts from Microsoft that lead one to believe they will be on a subscription plan sometime after Win10.

hmmm... with that said, would it be worth it to go with 10 then?

hmmm... with that said, would it be worth it to go with 10 then?

 

That's really a personal choice.    What I recommend to folks who ask is that if they're on '8, go to '10; but if they're on '7 and don't have a touch-screen device there's little reason to upgrade NOW ... but they should consider doing so next May/June to take advantage of the free upgrade [the delay is to let Microsoft kill any early "bugs" -- which I'm sure they will find  ].

 

The reason I'm staying on '7 is simply that I have a LOT of nicely configured older programs that I doubt would run on '10; and I also use Windows Media Center, which isn't available for '10.    I'll undoubtedly use '10 when I build a newer desktop, which I'll likely do next spring.

 

That leaves some food for the thoughts Thanks!

I've got a couple questions as I go through the VM endeavor through unraid management. I have a found 2.5" laptop drive that I can install in the unraid system for the VMs. I'm going through Lime-Tech's guide for setting up a VM line for line.

 

http://lime-technology.com/wiki/index.php/UnRAID_Manual_6#Installing_a_Windows_VM

 

I'm going to start with windows 10 because I can directly download the iso for it to be sure this is something I want to do before buying any other versions or OSs.

 

I have my typical unraid share where I have all my media. It is currently the only share I have.

 

Should I create a separate one for the install ISOs?

Separate one for actual VM installs (each vm get its own share or one for each VM?)

Separate one for VM backup

 

 

Don't know that it matters.  How mine is setup is attached as well as the shares I have setup.

 

 

Basically I have a folder where I store all of my ISOs.  Then for each VM I have a folder where I store the image files.  I did it this way because that is how Virtual Box (what I started with on a Windows Host) did it.  Also I thought if logs existed separately for each VM I might be better keeping them there.  Don't know if that is possible with unRAID haven't read much about KVM set mine up with prior experience on Virtual Box as I said.

I see... So you have a VM share on the cache disk and you contain all your VMs and ISOs there? I don't currently have a cache drive and don't really need one other than to put the VM installs on so they have quicker/read write. This is what I was thinking about using the 2.5" laptop drive for. Installing the drive and using it exclusively as a cache drive for the VMs, but not for any media transfer. I'm quite content with the setup I have for media transfer.

I don't use the cache drive as a cache drive either.  All array shares write straight to the array.

I don't use the cache drive as a cache drive either.  All array shares write straight to the array.

 

Ditto.

Thanks for bearing with me through my simple questions. I've run in to a couple more. I've got the 2.5" drive installed now and need to format it. I have no idea what is on it. I believe an OLD OSX install, but regardless I don't really care.

 

Since it has some sort of format, unraid isn't allowing me to format through the webgui. I'd assume I need to do this through command line on the server? I haven't found any formatting buttons in the webui yet.

 

I'd imagine I should format it with btrfs?

 

Should I create just one partition? I think I'll have a few VMs and ISO images on it. I should be able to put those on different shares within the single cache drive, correct?

 

 

Edit, I figured it out. Had to take the array offline, select filesystem for cache disk once I assigned it (chose btrfs, let me know if I should change) then I went ahead and started array and it then allowed me to format that drive.

I've got windows 10 almost 100% installed. No hiccups yet. It is downloading its mandatory updates. Not sure that I like that. It is using QEMU for display control. Kind of cool, I've never used it before. I've got a bit to learn, I think.

 

I've found a way to disable updates, however it will stop ALL updates. Since I won't have anything too important on the VM, this isn't a big deal for me right now.

http://www.thewindowsclub.com/turn-off-windows-update-in-windows-10

 

Everything seems to be working. I used private bridge. I'm not sure if I will be able to connect to printers or not, but if I can access a printer, internet (I can) and the unraid array for whatever I may need it for then I'll be completely happy with the private bridge setup. If not, then I'll need to go back and try the public bridge.