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monza

New UNRAID user looking for advice please

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Hi folks,

 

First post here and I am literally on the brink of jumping on the UNRAID bandwagon (hoping not to fall off too soon either!)

 

Therefore I wanted to ask the knowledgeable folks here some questions. First off here is the basic stuff I am going to be working with:

 

Motherboard:  ASUS A8N-Sli Premium (nForce 4 Sli with onboard 4 SATA II ports and onboard Silicon Image 3114R RAID with 4 SATA ports - 8 ports in total)

CPU:  AMD Athlon 64 x2 3800 CPU

Ram :  2GB (Corsair Platinum XMS 3202 CMX1024-3200C2PT)

NIC :  Onboard NVIDIA Gigabit (Marvel Yukon GbE)

Video:  Some crappy PCI card i can find lying in my drawer of old bits!

PSU: ThermalTake 480W PurePower

HDD Caddy: Coolermaster 4 in 3 Stacker Device Module http://www.thecoolingshop.com/product_info.php/products_id/1104

Cooling: 2x Sharkoon 80mm Silent Eagle 2000 Fan + the 120mm fan which comes with the Coolermaster above

 

Use:  I am going to primarily be using this to house my movies (mostly full BluRay ISO backups and some MKV's I have created to "save space" - 15GB vs 40GB!).  So i have very large files (say 40GB) which will be served up to combination of devices: PopcornHour A-200 (when it arrives), a few HTPC's, PS3 etc....

 

My current needs are to have at minimum 3TB of usable storage (i.e after parity and possibly a cache drive, if necessary)

 

Here are my thoughts on drive config:

 

2x 2TB OR 2x 1.5TB drives (need to purchase - exact make and model not determined yet - see below Q's)

2x 1TB drives (Seagate ST31000340AS : SATA300 7200rpm + 32Mb Cache,  i have read that i will need to ensure they are on firmware SD1A)

2x 750GB (Samsung HD753LJ : SATA300 7200rpm + 32Mb Cache)

2x 200GB (Maxtor  6L200M0 : SATA150 7200rpm + 8Mb Cache) - should i bother mixing these in considering i would need the Pro licence to support 8 drives and they are only SATA150?

 

The useful capacity calculator gives me this information:

Load on startup: 240W

Operating Load: Up to 102.4W

Idle (Spun Down) Load: 6.4W

 

Ok so here come all of the questions:

 

Q1) Should i go for 2TB or 1.5TB drives? For the 2TB drives I am looking at purchasing the 2TB Hitachi Deskstar (7K2000) drives which are 7200rpm. However they are 5 platter and just wanted to know if it would be a mistake to have them used for the Parity drive (and possibly the cache drive too???) Would they constantly be in use and therefore using a lot of energy? I can get these for £110 each (~$180USD)

 

Q2) Would it be wiser to use another make of 2TB drive (other ones in my budget are the WD "green" drives), however i think they are all 5400rpm which from what i have read gives me a considerable performance hit???

 

Q3) Should I just go for 1.5TB drives instead like the Samsung EcoGreen F2 1.5TB HD154UI or something else?

 

Q4) What is the view on mixing SATA300 and SATA150? Should i just not bother with the two 200GB SATA150 drives if it gives me a performance hit? I would only be using them as i have them lying around doing nothing.

 

Q5) Is it worth using a cache drive in my setup? If so, what drive would be best to use and which SATA port would i place it on (see question below)

 

Q6) I am a little unclear exactly how i would hook up all the drives. The motherboard has 4 SATA II ports and then 4 SATA-RAID ports. So that makes 8 ports in total. Are the SATA Raid ports SATA II speed or just SATA150?

 

Q7) Would there be any logic in putting half of the drives on the nForce4 SATA II ports and the other half on the SI 3114R RAID-SATA ports?

 

Q8) How about the cache and parity drives - where are they best placed?

 

Q9) Will my PSU of 480W be sufficient consider the loads mentioned above?

 

I appreciate i have many questions here, so thanks for taking the time to read through this and for your thoughts, opinions and suggestions.

 

H

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Welcome to the unRAID community!

 

Q1) Should i go for 2TB or 1.5TB drives? For the 2TB drives I am looking at purchasing the 2TB Hitachi Deskstar (7K2000) drives which are 7200rpm. However they are 5 platter and just wanted to know if it would be a mistake to have them used for the Parity drive (and possibly the cache drive too???) Would they constantly be in use and therefore using a lot of energy? I can get these for £110 each (~$180USD)

I personally choose new drives based on the current GB/$ 'sweet spot'.  At this point in time the 1.5 TB drives occupy that sweet spot, though the 2 TB drives should move in within the next couple of months.  See this thread for more info.

 

Q2) Would it be wiser to use another make of 2TB drive (other ones in my budget are the WD "green" drives), however i think they are all 5400rpm which from what i have read gives me a considerable performance hit???

I have had bad luck with Hitachi in the past, and I therefore avoid them.  In my mind, the only reliable brand at this point in time is WD.  However, I know that many, many unRAID users use that same Hitachi 2 TB drive and have no problems with it.

 

You will only see improved performance if both your parity drive and your data drives are of a faster rotational speed.  Therefore, having a 7200 rpm parity drive with all 5400 rpm data drives won't help you.  There is a compromise - having a 7200 rpm parity drive and one or more 7200 rpm data drives (just make these your most-used drives) as well as some 5400 rpm data drives.  In this case, your writes to the 7200 rpm data drives will be faster, and your writes to the 5400 rpm data drives will be slower.  My advice on the matter is to just go for all low power 5400 or 5900 rpm drives for parity and data and then get a faster 7200 rpm cache drive.  This will improve your server's perceived write speed since all writes will initially be going to the faster cache drive.  All this really does is postpone the inevitable slow writes until later in the night when the server is otherwise idle.

 

Q3) Should I just go for 1.5TB drives instead like the Samsung EcoGreen F2 1.5TB HD154UI or something else?

I basically answered this above, but again, I prefer to go for the 'greenest' drives available, and I don't care about their rotational speed one bit.  If you find a Samsung EcoGreen 1.5 TB for a good price, then go for it.  Just don't bother with any 'black' (high speed) drives, and especially don't bother with any 'RAID' class drives, that is just money down the drain.  The only exception to this is the cache drive, but that's debatable.

 

Q4) What is the view on mixing SATA300 and SATA150? Should i just not bother with the two 200GB SATA150 drives if it gives me a performance hit? I would only be using them as i have them lying around doing nothing.

Go for it.  The only performance hit you will see is during your initial parity build and your monthly parity checks, but those will most likely occur overnight when you don't really care about the speed anyway.  SATA 150 is plenty fast enough to saturate a gigabit LAN connection, and therefore plenty fast enough to stream HD content from.

 

Q5) Is it worth using a cache drive in my setup? If so, what drive would be best to use and which SATA port would i place it on (see question below)

If you care about write speeds to your server, then yes.  Adding a cache drive is the going to make the most difference to your perceived write speeds, though keep in mind that it is really just delaying the inevitable.  However, if you don't plan on writing new data to your server very often, then don't bother with one.

 

On the other hand, if you will treat your server like an archive, meaning that after the initial transfer of all your BluRay movies and data you will cease writing anything to the server on a regular basis and only read from it to stream the movies, then don't bother with a cache drive.  Again, the cache drive only helps with writes to the server, and only perceived writes at that.

 

Another nice feature about having a cache drive is that you can treat it as a warm spare.  This means that if one of the other drives in your server dies, you can simply unassign the cache drive and assign it into the dead drive's slot, without even powering down the server!  Make sure to run the mover script first so as to clear off any data that may be sitting on the cache drive, otherwise that data will be lost.  This 'warm spare' concept basically buys you some time to get by while waiting for the dead drive's RMA to go through, or waiting for your new replacement drive to be shipped to you.  The only downside of this approach is that the cache drive has to be as big as your parity drive or bigger, so there's a bit of overhead involved.  I personally choose not to do this because I don't like the idea of a massive 1.5 or 2 TB drive just sitting there being unused 90% of the time.  If one of my larger drives dies and I want to be perfectly sure that another drive won't die during the interim, I'm ok with leaving my server powered off for a few days while I wait for the new drive to arrive (this is an extreme case, it is possible to keep using the server as you normally would, though there is some measure of risk involved).

 

My personal approach to the cache drive is a bit different.  I choose to use my smallest drive as my cache drive, since that is the drive that I can deal with 'wasting'.  I'm currently using a 320 GB 7200 rpm drive that I've had for many years.  Based on this logic, I would recommend that you use one of your slow 200 GB drives as your cache drives.  Again, SATA 150 is plenty fast enough, and the 7200 rpm spindle speed on those drives should help you gain slightly faster writes.  Also, 200 GBs is more than enough to move a full sized BluRay rip or two over to your server at one time.

 

Q6) I am a little unclear exactly how i would hook up all the drives. The motherboard has 4 SATA II ports and then 4 SATA-RAID ports. So that makes 8 ports in total. Are the SATA Raid ports SATA II speed or just SATA150?

 

Q7) Would there be any logic in putting half of the drives on the nForce4 SATA II ports and the other half on the SI 3114R RAID-SATA ports?

 

Q8) How about the cache and parity drives - where are they best placed?

I don't know the answer to any of these since I've never encountered a motherboard with two different types of SATA ports like yours has.  I'll have to defer to a hero member here.

 

Q9) Will my PSU of 480W be sufficient consider the loads mentioned above?

Yes, 480W should be fine.  I'm currently running an 8 disk server on a 380W PSU.  Also keep in mind that you can save a bit of power by running your server headless.  This means that you would use whatever crappy video card you find for the initial install and configuration, then remove it and only ever put it back in if you need to troubleshoot.  Many unRAID users do this.

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Thank you so much for the detailed reply - it is very much appreciated!

 

I just ordered two of the Samsung 1.5TB F2's (HD154UI) and i think they will be better energy wise in the long run and also as you say will do the job. I think i will also be using a cache drive (probably one of the Maxtor 200GB drives) so my drive layout should look like this:

 

1.5TB          Parity Drive          Samsung HD154UI

1.5TB          Data Drive          Samsung HD154UI

750GB          Data Drive          Samsung HD753LJ

750GB          Data Drive          Samsung HD753LJ

200GB          Data Drive          Maxtor  6L200M0

200GB          Cache Drive          Maxtor  6L200M0

 

 

equates to:

 

Data Storage Capacity: 3 TB (According to manufacturers)

Data Storage Capacity: 2.72 TB (Actual storage space)

 

 

Only thing i need to figure out now is how to best connect them to the A8N-Sli Premium as i am a bit lost on that front... hoping someone else can give me this nugget of information? fingers crossed...

 

H

 

p.s i saw this nifty little device which i plan on using to house my unraid USB key internally (http://www.scan.co.uk/Products/Lycom-UB-109-Internal-Motherboard-header-2x5-pin-USB2-Header-to-2-USB-A-type-Adapter)

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Only thing i need to figure out now is how to best connect them to the A8N-Sli Premium as i am a bit lost on that front... hoping someone else can give me this nugget of information? fingers crossed...

I have the same board, and did a short test to see if there was any speed difference while I was setting things up. I got no significant difference between the two ports. The disks are the bottlenecks here.

 

I did learn something as late as yesterday. If you want to add upp to 4GB, do not enable the memory remapping feature in BIOS. It will crash the system. I found some odd mention of it somwhere on the net that confirmed this. Just a heads up for future expansion :-)

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Only thing i need to figure out now is how to best connect them to the A8N-Sli Premium as i am a bit lost on that front... hoping someone else can give me this nugget of information? fingers crossed...

I have the same board, and did a short test to see if there was any speed difference while I was setting things up. I got no significant difference between the two ports. The disks are the bottlenecks here.

 

I did learn something as late as yesterday. If you want to add upp to 4GB, do not enable the memory remapping feature in BIOS. It will crash the system. I found some odd mention of it somwhere on the net that confirmed this. Just a heads up for future expansion :-)

 

This is great information, thanks! I am looking to actually start putting my setup together in a few weeks and am in the "information gathering" stage.

 

I may have some more questions for you, but do you mind me asking what your setup is so I can compare and maybe pickup some tips?

 

thanks again!  ;D

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I believe the 3114 is on the PCI bus. i'd avoid putting too many or your largest drives there.

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I believe the 3114 is on the PCI bus. i'd avoid putting too many or your largest drives there.

 

yes, that is correct. I am looking to put most my drives on the on-board SATA II ports. I am also looking to aquire an Adaptec 1430SA (4port SATA II card)

 

That will give me 8 SATA II ports to play with which (plus the 4 SATA on the 3114) will be plenty enough (for the moment anyway..)  :P

 

 

cheers

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1.5TB          Parity Drive          Samsung HD154UI

1.5TB          Data Drive          Samsung HD154UI

750GB          Data Drive          Samsung HD753LJ

750GB          Data Drive          Samsung HD753LJ

200GB          Data Drive          Maxtor  6L200M0

200GB          Cache Drive          Maxtor  6L200M0

 

equates to:

 

Data Storage Capacity: 3 TB (According to manufacturers)

Data Storage Capacity: 2.72 TB (Actual storage space)

 

You seem to have omitted your 200 GB data drive in that calculation, or maybe you were just rounding it out.  The actual numbers are:

 

Data Storage Capacity: 3.2 TB (According to manufacturers)

Data Storage Capacity: 2969.2 GB or 2.97 TB (Actual storage space)

 

Also, if your 4 SATA ports on the 3114 are actually bottlenecked through the PCI bus, then I would advise using them for just one disk disk, probably your 200 GB data drive.  PCI is fast enough to keep up with just one drive being accessed at a time, its only slow when you have multiple drives on it that are all being accessed at once (such as during a parity check).  Or, if speed isn't your concern, you can just use all your onboard ports and save a bit of money by not buying the expansion card.  Your choice.

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ok, just wanted to give an update and share some stuff which i hope helps other people.

 

Firstly my drive allocation now looks like this:

 

http://img51.imageshack.us/img51/1394/drivesspreadsheet.jpg

 

drivesspreadsheet.jpg

 

I also created some info labels to make sure i can keep track of the drives whilst in the computer (nothing more frustrating than having to take out a drive to check a serial number or size of drive...)

 

http://img8.imageshack.us/img8/6733/drivesphoto2.jpg

drivesphoto2.jpg

 

Still got to label up my two 750GB drives which ill do once i pulled them from my other PC...

 

If anyone wants the templates i used i have attached them to this post. FYI, i used Avery L7163 labels which are exactly the correct width of 3.5" HDD !  ;D

 

[sorry for anyone who tried to download the files - seems as they got corrupted in the u/load, d/load, rename process! -  should be fixed now...]

 

Drive_Config_Template.zip

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Thanks for rehosting those pictures, I couldn't see them before.

 

One small mistake on your chart, your sizes are in GB not MB.

 

Very clean, though, and I like the labels.  I labeled my drives with a blue sharpie...didn't turn out so hot.  You can still read the labels at certain angles and with the light just right  ;D

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lol, thanks for spotting the silly mistake

 

Yeah i did for a second think about just using a marker pen, but thought I may as well get some labels made up and then share it with the rest of the helpful folks here.

 

Tomorrow i start the pre-clear process! Think its gonna take me a good few days to get through all my drives...

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Tomorrow i start the pre-clear process! Think its gonna take me a good few days to get through all my drives...

Just so you know, you can run preclear scripts on multiple drives simultaneously.  I've done it, works well.

 

 

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yeah i read that, and actually one thing i wanted to check was if i could run it multiple times using the console actually on the server?

 

I know you can telnet in multiple times to run the script in each telnet session (window), but how do you do this from the console on the server itself? sorry if this is a really dumn n00b question !

 

 

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actually one thing i wanted to check was if i could run it multiple times using the console actually on the server?

 

Yes, you can.  You have tty1 through tty6 there, and you can switch between them with Alt-F1 through Alt-F6.

 

 

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ok i am up and running with unRAID 4.5.3 PRO whoo hoooo!  8)

 

So many questions my brain is going to explode (searching the forums is like a drug!)

 

1) I am getting 40MB/s transfer over my gigabit network to an unprotected array (still copying my data to the server from my old, soon to be redundant NAS box). This seems ok right?

 

2) Tying to get my head around shares - i think this is probably the most complicated thing so far lol. Let me explain my usecase and maybe someone can guide me on how to setup the shares, what features to use (e.g Split level) and what features to not bother with...

 

Right, my server looks like this at the moment:

 

diveconfig06march2010.jpg

 

unRAID calcuator tells me that i have 5.44TB of usable space (and i am not using a cache drive)

So to reiterate, my Parity disk is not yet enabled.  I have split the load evenly over the onboard SATAII and the 1430SA card (3 drives on each).

 

 

 

> My media consists mainly of movie backups from DVD (4GB files) and now BluRay ISO (40+GB files)

> I want to "dedicated/reserve" a slice of my disk array, say 3GB to these movies for now.

> I want to be able to add a new drive later down the line and just increase this "dedicated/reserved" space to use the new drive i added

> I want readonly of the "Movie" share from my media streamer (PCH A-200) using both SMB and NFS

> I want full access (read/write) to the "Movie" share from my PC/Laptop and HTPC using SMB

> Can certain folder within my "Movies" collection be shown for certain users and hidden for others?

> I want certain folders to be hidden from certain users (e.g i can only see my own Documents in the "Documents" section)

 

>The other categories i want to have stored on my disk array are: Photos (current size about 50GB), Documents (current size about 50GB), Software (current size about 500GB)

 

I kinda got stuck on how to get everything configured in the web interface with all the different settings (i am also going to put a post in the suggestions forum on how to make the UI for the shares more intuitive so you do not need to reference information elsewhere (forum, wiki etc)

 

<on a side note - does anyone know why there is no "online" help for the basic featuresin the web interface. My assumption is that this is becuase of the effort to update or maintain it?>

 

Thanks folks!

 

 

P.S - can someone urgently tell me how i can re-use a disk in windows that has been part of an unRAID array. Basically i had a few spare 200GB HDD lying around and then built a test unraid box using the free license. Now i removed them (as i have bigger drives in my "production" server) but i cant seem to format them in windows. It shows them as RAW and nothing i can try manages to actually clear them to use in windows (NTFS).

 

 

 

 

 

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You shouldn't have any trouble formatting a disk previously used in unRAID with a Windows computer.  I have done just that many times.  You will lose all of the data on the disk, of course.

 

Hook up the drive to the Windows computer either internally or externally, then in Windows:

1) Right click on 'Computer' or 'My Computer'.

2) Click 'Manage'

3) Click 'Disk Management'

4) Select the drive from the list, right click, choose 'Format'

 

Here's some brief answers to your other questions:

1) Yes, 40 MB/s sounds fine.  I've never run an unprotected array, so I can't be 100% certain.

 

2) You can use the 'includes' and 'excludes' options (on the 'shares' page) to specify certain disks that a user share can and cannot use.  You can therefore designate certain disks to be 'movies only,' or whatever you like.  For example, your 'Movies' user share could include:

disk1, disk2

 

and exclude

disk3, disk4

 

(type them in just like that, no space between 'disk' and the number)

 

3) You can set up 'user level security' with two different user accounts.  Mine looks like this:

admin: read/write, passworded

guest: read-only, no password

 

Under 'shares,' change the user shares export option to 'read-only'.  Then on each user share, add an exception for 'admin'.  Configure your media player to remember the 'guest' login info, and your PC to remember the 'admin' login info.

 

4) I don't know how to make certain folders hidden.

 

5) The 'online help' is this forum and the wiki.

 

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P.S - can someone urgently tell me how i can re-use a disk in windows that has been part of an unRAID array. Basically i had a few spare 200GB HDD lying around and then built a test unraid box using the free license. Now i removed them (as i have bigger drives in my "production" server) but i cant seem to format them in windows. It shows them as RAW and nothing i can try manages to actually clear them to use in windows (NTFS).

 

Format may not be working because windows does not see that partition as a valid windows partition.

(byte 450(d) on your disk likely has the value 0x83 which indicates a Linux partition.  The NTFS value is 0x07)

Simply delete that partition and then create a new partition: 'My Computer' --> 'Manage' --> 'Disk Management' ...

 

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ok so i setup the shares as instructed... only problem is i cannot see the "movies" share when i ftp into my server? I sucessfully see the individual disks and managed to copy files to disk1 using my ftp client, however when it completed i didnt see the file in the disk1 folder in my ftp client (Cute FTP). The file does exist on the server as i can see it browsing via SMB share on my PC and also via the unMENU file browser.

 

any ideas?  ???

 

p.s i tried logging into the server on ftp via the root and the admin user account i setup - still dont see the file via the ftp client.

 

thanks!

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anyone care to comment on hard drives which are running "too cold" ?

 

My server lives in the loft/attic and it gets quite cold up there (but not damp or moist as the humidity is controlled).

 

When i check temps on my drives in the morning they are regularly between 10 and 15 degrees celsius. After about fifteen minutes of on / off use they get upto around 25 degrees. They are Samsung drives (1.5TB F2's) - i seem to recall a post where someone said that the Samsungs are notorious for reporting lower than actual temps - which is even more troublesome now!

 

So am i worrying for nothing or should i maybe turn off some of my case fans to raise the temps a little ?

 

any help or advice is greatly appreciated.

 

By the way there are zero errors or warnings from SMART report or in the unraid tower menu so far (server has been running 24/7 for just over 1 week)

 

thanks!

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anyone care to comment on hard drives which are running "too cold" ?

So am i worrying for nothing or should i maybe turn off some of my case fans to raise the temps a little ?

 

any help or advice is greatly appreciated.

 

There is a such thing as too cold for drives which are not spinning all the time.

Our mainframe drives used to fail more often when we spun them down over the weekend.

Upon spin up monday morning you would hear the bearings sing.

 

Drives today are a different caliber, but those temps seem a bit cold.

The drives probably cannot be colder then ambient temperature, so I would use something there to give me an idea.

 

I've read that during idle they report very low, and after 10 minutes of spinning they are closer to being accurate.

 

I don't know if I would turn off fans, but I might go with temperature sensing fans instead.

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There is a such thing as too cold for drives which are not spinning all the time.

 

10-15 degs is perfectly acceptable idle temperature for a HDD. 25-30 degs when working. In a still air the drives temperature should be ambient, however most PCs cases are actively cooled. Get an IR temperature gun and point it at the drive to see what temperature it is. Do the same to the case. My unraid case is always cold to the touch.

 

Our mainframe drives used to fail more often when we spun them down over the weekend.

Upon spin up monday morning you would hear the bearings sing.

 

This is due to them being knackered, not cold. ;-)

We used to put HDDs with required data in the freezer to get them to work, cans of freezer spray can work too. 

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We used to put HDDs with required data in the freezer to get them to work, cans of freezer spray can work too. 

 

I've read this works for hard drives in which the bearings have frozen.

I tried this one time. After I put it in a warm PC condensation started to form. It did not get any better.

 

Monza, I think the 15c temp is fine. If within a few moments it jumps in the 20-25c range then you are ok.

 

An issue to consider is condensation (during warm up.. of which you said has been taken care of)

 

Another is wide temperature variances throughout the year.

 

If you start hitting 50c in summer and 10c in winter, those are some wide variances and I'm sure it will have an effect in the mid term.

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thanks for all the replies...

 

I think i may disable one of the fans over the drives which are idleing at 10 - 15 degrees and see how they react. Anyone know of a way to be alerted via email if drives get over a certain temperature?

 

cheers

 

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OK... so after over 1 year of 24/7/365 flawless running, I think my motherboard has given up the ghost  :(

 

Basically it was running fine a few days ago when i last accessed it and then this morning i tried to connect to the web admin interface and it wouldnt load. So i popped into the loft/attic and when i turned on the monitor it was stuck on the boot screen, just after the bios finishes testing the memory, so it had obviously rebooted itself somehow)

 

So i hard rebooted and tried again and the same thing happened. Then i booted into the BIOS to check it out - all the settings were the same as before and nothing had changed (except mysteriously my USB drive wasnt appearing as a device on the boot order screen). Then i thought the USB stick must have given up the ghost..but when i plugged it into my laptop it was working fine and i could access all the unRAID files - i took the opportunity to make a backup of the files onto my laptop whilst i was at it...

 

Then i noticed that when i plugged the USB drive into the USB slot on my unRAID machine, the little blue light didnt illuminate on it (like it just did when i connected it to my laptop)... Anyway (after all that rambling) .. i think ALL my motherboard's USB ports are knackered SOMEHOW?!?! (we did have some lightening a few days ago - but this is probably nothing to do with it...)

 

I tried a different USB drive and the same issue - no light... its like they are not getting power, and before they would appear in the BIOS so i could select them as the boot device, but now nothing appears so i cant boot off the USB stick.

 

So... what are my options?

 

1) Try a USB PCI add in card? Anyone know one that works (is this even possible to use - i tried using search and didnt find anything showing sucess!)

 

2) Try to obtain the same motherboard again off eBAY and see if it is indeed a problem with the MB?

 

3) Build another server...

 

If it isnt the USB ports then what the hell could it be?

 

any advice?

 

thanks

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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