Jump to content
RobJ

Windows issues with unRAID

127 posts in this topic Last Reply

Recommended Posts

Posted (edited)

Got it sorted.
Isolated the entire rest of the network other than the server and my router/modem.
No switches, no UPS, no access points, etc.
Didn't help.

So I could only assume it was something wrong with my settings in Unraid.

It was.

Turns out I overlooked the SMB default setting as "Active Directory" instead of "Workgroup"
As soon as I changed it, presto.

So everyone have a laugh at me, I can take it.
Thanks so much for everyone that has contributed to this thread.
Anyone else that reads this...

<b> Check that you've changed from Active Directory to Workgroup!! </b>


Thanks Guys.

Also, how do I go about requesting another trial?
Burnt 3 out of 4 weeks chasing my tail because I'm an idiot.
Thanks again!

Good News Farnsworth.jpg

Edited by Steve Bal4

Share this post


Link to post
11 minutes ago, Steve Bal4 said:

Also, how do I go about requesting another trial?

You can extend the trial twice for another 15 days (30 total).

Share this post


Link to post

For anyone who has never ending problems with SMB and Window 10, If you are using WIN10 PRO (or above), you can use NFS instead of SMB.  You will need to be somewhat comfortable in the use of the command line in Windows (called Command Prompt in WIN10).  Note that this will require that you mount your NFS share(s) as a mapped drive(s) in Windows.  If you want to minimize the number of mapped drives, I would suggest using   /mnt/user0  as the mount point.  The following article describes the steps that are necessary.

 

    https://graspingtech.com/mount-nfs-share-windows-10/

 

I have not yet tried this but it seems fairly straight forward.  Enabling the NFS services will add another command to the Windows shell-- mount which is used to setting up the mapped drive on your Windows computer.  Note that in the instructions, it is setting up the anonymous user as root which could be a potential security risk.  

Share this post


Link to post
On 8/29/2019 at 7:12 AM, Frank1940 said:

For anyone who has never ending problems with SMB and Window 10, If you are using WIN10 PRO (or above), you can use NFS instead of SMB.  You will need to be somewhat comfortable in the use of the command line in Windows (called Command Prompt in WIN10).  Note that this will require that you mount your NFS share(s) as a mapped drive(s) in Windows.  If you want to minimize the number of mapped drives, I would suggest using   /mnt/user0  as the mount point.  The following article describes the steps that are necessary.

 

    https://graspingtech.com/mount-nfs-share-windows-10/

 

I have not yet tried this but it seems fairly straight forward.  Enabling the NFS services will add another command to the Windows shell-- mount which is used to setting up the mapped drive on your Windows computer.  Note that in the instructions, it is setting up the anonymous user as root which could be a potential security risk.  

Thank you. I've been looking at doing this. Getting tired of Windows and all the updates screwing up my SMB shares. 

Share this post


Link to post

I am having trouble being able to see my unraid server under networks in explorer. I've looked at the other threads but I'm not getting anywhere. I alteady have the drive mapped but the problem is I have a program I am trying to use that doesn't see the mapped drives. So I can only access it through the network part of explorer. I enabled SMB1, allowed insecure logins, but still nothing.

Share this post


Link to post
6 minutes ago, bobbintb said:

I am having trouble being able to see my unraid server under networks in explorer. I've looked at the other threads but I'm not getting anywhere. I alteady have the drive mapped but the problem is I have a program I am trying to use that doesn't see the mapped drives. So I can only access it through the network part of explorer. I enabled SMB1, allowed insecure logins, but still nothing.

I am assuming that you are using WIN10.  Did you do this:

 

          https://forums.unraid.net/topic/53172-windows-issues-with-unraid/page/4/?tab=comments#comment-758464

 

Share this post


Link to post
On 9/14/2019 at 1:27 PM, Frank1940 said:

I am assuming that you are using WIN10.  Did you do this:

 

          https://forums.unraid.net/topic/53172-windows-issues-with-unraid/page/4/?tab=comments#comment-758464

 

I did. But I figured a way to get around the issue with the program. I hate networking on Windows. I always have a different issue with any computer I want to connect to the server through Windows.

Share this post


Link to post

If as you try to access unsecured unRAID, you get a request to "Enter Network Credentials", try this:

 

 

Apparently several folks have found that this will work! 

Edited by Frank1940

Share this post


Link to post

I have issues with SMB on my Unraid install, both windows 2012 r2 and windows 10 pro are behaving the same.

 

Samba is accessible and fine with my credentials i have setup but randomly when i write data to the array via smb the connection drops and smb stops responding, Unraid still responds to ping from the computer though so it's a not a connectivity issue but a SMB issue.

 

I am preclearing some drives so i cannot enable smb logging for now but i will report back with what i find in the smb logs once i have time to do so, i really hope to resolve this as smb is a major part of my network. Unraid is built on linux, i have 3 linux installs all that have smb, they all work properly so not sure what's specific with the smb on unraid.

Share this post


Link to post
12 minutes ago, je82 said:

Unraid is built on linux, i have 3 linux installs all that have smb, they all work properly so not sure what's specific with the smb on unraid.

Does this mean that SMB is working between the Linux PC and Unraid?  Please test this out to help define the source of the problem.

Share this post


Link to post
1 minute ago, Frank1940 said:

Does this mean that SMB is working between the Linux PC and Unraid?  Please test this out to help define the source of the problem.

Not sure yet as it is only occuring when i am transfering large amount of files and all my linux installs are tiny webservers that don't have any big files to transfer.... i would have to put up a new linux machine and do that test if need be, but first i am going to enable smb logging and see what that tells me but right now i am preclearing some disks so it will have to wait until tomorrow :(

Share this post


Link to post
23 minutes ago, je82 said:

but randomly when i write data to the array via smb the connection drops and smb stops responding, Unraid still responds to ping from the computer though so it's a not a connectivity issue but a SMB issue.

 

IF this is true, then I would assume that it would be impossible to get any SMB transaction to take place (example, a file listing  of a Unraid SMB share) to take place if the problem were on the Unraid end.  Remember that it can also be a switching /network problem. 

Share this post


Link to post
9 minutes ago, Frank1940 said:

IF this is true, then I would assume that it would be impossible to get any SMB transaction to take place (example, a file listing  of a Unraid SMB share) to take place if the problem were on the Unraid end.  Remember that it can also be a switching /network problem. 

if it was a connectivity issue wouldn't pings be dropped when network errors occurs?

 

I start transferring files, suddenly after like a couple of minues the transfer halts and i get a permission error, right after this error occurs i cannot access the unraid install via \\hostname\sharename\ but i can ping the unraid server and my ssh session does not drop either, also i can ping from the unraid server to the network while this occurs as well.

 

I do believe it is the smb daemon that is hung and restarts. I will have to wait until the pre clear is done to enable smb logging to see whats going on, no errors being logged in the regular logs as far as i can tell

Edited by je82

Share this post


Link to post
7 minutes ago, je82 said:

I start transferring files, suddenly after like a couple of minues the transfer halts and i get a permission error, right after this error occurs i cannot access the unraid install via \\hostname\sharename\ but i can ping the unraid server and my ssh session does not drop either, also i can ping from the unraid server to the network while this occurs as well.

It is at this point that you want to try to access SMB on Unraid from another computer. 

 

A point of clarification.  You are doing a single transfer of a large number of files.   You are not doing a large number of transfers of a small number of files. 

Share this post


Link to post
30 minutes ago, Frank1940 said:

It is at this point that you want to try to access SMB on Unraid from another computer. 

 

A point of clarification.  You are doing a single transfer of a large number of files.   You are not doing a large number of transfers of a small number of files. 

One batch of 200gb of random files ranging in between 700mb/4gb per file, media stuff... just ctrl-v / ctrl-c in explorer to the unraid share.

 

Update: i did try the thing you mentioned now, and unraid SMB becomes unaccessible from another client machine at the same time as SMB drops from the machine transferring the files, both computers can ping the unraid server so network connectivity is not lost.

 

It's definitely something with smb. I read here about some issue that seems very near what i am experiencing:

https://www.ixsystems.com/community/threads/smb-shares-dropping-during-write.73204/

https://redmine.ixsystems.com/issues/43558#change-495697

 

Updated: verified that it is not a simple bad network cable issue, same thing occurs with different cable. Also verified that when smb drops the webgui is still up and accessible.

Edited by je82

Share this post


Link to post

A couple of more small items:  (1) Are you using a cache Drive?  If so, SSD or HD?   (2) what setting are your using on the   Settings  >>>  Disk Settings    "Tunable (md_write_method):" 

2 hours ago, je82 said:

One batch of 200gb of random files ranging in between 700mb/4gb per file, media stuff

This is a bit more than most folks are doing but that should not cause a problem.  (50GB is about the max I ever do at one time and it is usually a single file.)  This could be the reason that it has not been discovered earlier...

 

With that out of the way, let's look at this from your last post:

2 hours ago, je82 said:

Update: i did try the thing you mentioned now, and unraid SMB becomes unaccessible from another client machine at the same time as SMB drops from the machine transferring the files, both computers can ping the unraid server so network connectivity is not lost.

 

It's definitely something with smb. I read here about some issue that seems very near what i am experiencing:

https://www.ixsystems.com/community/threads/smb-shares-dropping-during-write.73204/

https://redmine.ixsystems.com/issues/43558#change-495697

It looks to me like you may have uncovered a bug.  It certainly appears that it is in the samba module of Unraid.  The sub-forum just under this one is the place to report bugs.  There are two sections in this sub-forum, one for the staple releases and one for the prerelease candidates.  (You might want to try the prerelease candidate as there is probably a new version of samba in the candidate.)  Be sure to read the sticky on how to report a bug.  (The info you provided from my questions should probably be included in your report.)

Share this post


Link to post
6 hours ago, Frank1940 said:

A couple of more small items:  (1) Are you using a cache Drive?  If so, SSD or HD?   (2) what setting are your using on the   Settings  >>>  Disk Settings    "Tunable (md_write_method):" 

This is a bit more than most folks are doing but that should not cause a problem.  (50GB is about the max I ever do at one time and it is usually a single file.)  This could be the reason that it has not been discovered earlier...

 

With that out of the way, let's look at this from your last post:

It looks to me like you may have uncovered a bug.  It certainly appears that it is in the samba module of Unraid.  The sub-forum just under this one is the place to report bugs.  There are two sections in this sub-forum, one for the staple releases and one for the prerelease candidates.  (You might want to try the prerelease candidate as there is probably a new version of samba in the candidate.)  Be sure to read the sticky on how to report a bug.  (The info you provided from my questions should probably be included in your report.)

My preclear disks are done in 2 hours from now, i will then enable smb logging and see if smb is crashing and provide logs.

My setup is as follows:

 

1. No cache is being used at the moment. I have 2x 1tb SSD cache's but they are not being used for now because i am trying to migrate over 100tb data, this migration is being done via SMB. The share i am sending data to does not have cache enabled.

 

2. Tunable (md_write_method): is set to "auto" which i guess is the default value? I have tested using the plugin "CA Auto Turbo Write Mode" enabled / disabled but i don't really see any difference in speeds, neither do i see any difference in smb being more stable with/without.

Share this post


Link to post

So i have SMB logging enabled and its very verbose... hard to find what i am looking for. I did send around 50gb of random files until it occured again. What i can gather it seems that the SMB is throwing access denied mid stream as a file is being transferred, see below:

 

Nov  6 11:57:18 NAS smbd[28881]:   smb2: fnum 848165825, file Unsorted New/3DRenderTest2.mp4>
Nov  6 11:57:18 NAS smbd[28881]: [2019/11/06 11:57:18.241739,  3] ../lib/util/access.c:365(allow_access)
Nov  6 11:57:18 NAS smbd[28881]:   Allowed connection from 1.1.1.2 (1.1.1.2)
Nov  6 11:57:18 NAS smbd[28881]: [2019/11/06 11:57:18.241765,  1] ../source3/smbd/service.c:346(create_connection_session_info)
Nov  6 11:57:18 NAS smbd[28881]:   create_connection_session_info: guest user (from session setup) not permitted to access this >
Nov  6 11:57:18 NAS smbd[28881]: [2019/11/06 11:57:18.241778,  1] ../source3/smbd/service.c:529(make_connection_snum)
Nov  6 11:57:18 NAS smbd[28881]:   create_connection_session_info failed: NT_STATUS_ACCESS_DENIED

Nov  6 11:57:18 NAS smbd[28881]:   smb2: fnum 848165825, file Unsorted New/3DRenderTest2.mp4>

 

Later during same file transfer:


Nov  6 12:00:37 NAS smbd[28881]: [2019/11/06 12:00:37.654102,  3] ../auth/ntlmssp/ntlmssp_util.c:72(debug_ntlmssp_flags)
Nov  6 12:00:37 NAS smbd[28881]:   Got NTLMSSP neg_flags=0xe2088297

Nov  6 12:00:37 NAS smbd[28881]: [2019/11/06 12:00:37.715919,  3] ../auth/ntlmssp/ntlmssp_server.c:552(ntlmssp_server_preauth)
Nov  6 12:00:37 NAS smbd[28881]:   Got user=[] domain=[] workstation=[DESKTOP] len1=1 len2=0
Nov  6 12:00:37 NAS smbd[28881]: [2019/11/06 12:00:37.715962,  3] ../source3/param/loadparm.c:3872(lp_load_ex)
Nov  6 12:00:37 NAS smbd[28881]:   lp_load_ex: refreshing parameters
Nov  6 12:00:37 NAS smbd[28881]: [2019/11/06 12:00:37.716040,  3] ../source3/param/loadparm.c:548(init_globals)
Nov  6 12:00:37 NAS smbd[28881]:   Initialising global parameters
Nov  6 12:00:37 NAS smbd[28881]: [2019/11/06 12:00:37.716171,  3] ../source3/param/loadparm.c:2786(lp_do_section)
Nov  6 12:00:37 NAS smbd[28881]:   Processing section "[global]"
Nov  6 12:00:37 NAS smbd[28881]: [2019/11/06 12:00:37.716336,  1] ../lib/param/loadparm.c:1822(lpcfg_do_global_parameter)
Nov  6 12:00:37 NAS smbd[28881]:   WARNING: The "null passwords" option is deprecated
Nov  6 12:00:37 NAS smbd[28881]: [2019/11/06 12:00:37.716610,  2] ../source3/param/loadparm.c:2803(lp_do_section)
Nov  6 12:00:37 NAS smbd[28881]:   Processing section "[flash]"
Nov  6 12:00:37 NAS smbd[28881]: [2019/11/06 12:00:37.716765,  2] ../source3/param/loadparm.c:2803(lp_do_section)
Nov  6 12:00:37 NAS smbd[28881]:   Processing section "[Work]"
Nov  6 12:00:37 NAS smbd[28881]: [2019/11/06 12:00:37.716841,  3] ../source3/param/loadparm.c:1621(lp_add_ipc)
Nov  6 12:00:37 NAS smbd[28881]:   adding IPC service
Nov  6 12:00:37 NAS smbd[28881]: [2019/11/06 12:00:37.716867,  3] ../source3/auth/auth.c:189(auth_check_ntlm_password)
Nov  6 12:00:37 NAS smbd[28881]:   check_ntlm_password:  Checking password for unmapped user []\[]@[DESKTOP] with the new passwo>
Nov  6 12:00:37 NAS smbd[28881]: [2019/11/06 12:00:37.716882,  3] ../source3/auth/auth.c:192(auth_check_ntlm_password)
Nov  6 12:00:37 NAS smbd[28881]:   check_ntlm_password:  mapped user is: []\[]@[DESKTOP]
Nov  6 12:00:37 NAS smbd[28881]: [2019/11/06 12:00:37.716897,  3] ../source3/auth/auth.c:256(auth_check_ntlm_password)
Nov  6 12:00:37 NAS smbd[28881]:   auth_check_ntlm_password: anonymous authentication for user [] succeeded
Nov  6 12:00:37 NAS smbd[28881]: [2019/11/06 12:00:37.716921,  3] ../auth/auth_log.c:610(log_authentication_event_human_readable)
Nov  6 12:00:37 NAS smbd[28881]:   Auth: [SMB2,(null)] user []\[] at [Wed, 06 Nov 2019 12:00:37.716911 CET] with [(null)] status>
Nov  6 12:00:37 NAS smbd[28881]:   {"timestamp": "2019-11-06T12:00:37.716954+0100", "type": "Authentication", "Authentication": >
Nov  6 12:00:37 NAS smbd[28881]: [2019/11/06 12:00:37.717204,  3] ../source3/smbd/smb2_write.c:215(smb2_write_complete_internal)

 

I can't be certain that this is the cause though, but whenever the speed dropped to 0 and smb timed out from what i can tell this message was the only thing out of the ordinary.

 

I have no entries in my cred vault @ windows, i do use the same credentials for my windows machine as the account on the unraid smb share that has access. Any ideas  if this is the problem? I find it strange that other clients would experience access issues at the exact same time to the unraid as it is throwing denieds to the machine transferring though, but maybe?

 

I will have to do more file transfers.

 

 

Edited by je82

Share this post


Link to post

I have now hardcoded 2 entries into my credentials vault in the windows machine sending the files, my idea is that windows smb is randomly for whatever reason authenticating with the wrong credentials resulting in a read/write error, the strange thing is this did not occur as far as i can tell with my old unraid installation which i did send over 200gb of files via smb to.

 

Will report back with how it goes.

 

EDIT: Thinking of it i may have had the share public access for everyone on the unraid test. I only tested so that account security worked properly on 1 share but this was not the share i decided to fill with data when testing.

Edited by je82

Share this post


Link to post
33 minutes ago, je82 said:

my idea is that windows smb is randomly for whatever reason authenticating with the wrong credentials resulting in a read/write error,

Windows will authenticate with whatever is used for the first share you access on the server.   All subsequent accesses to the server will use those credentials regardless of what security is set for a share and whether you get prompted for credentials.   The order of access to shares is therefore critical if any are set to not be public!

Share this post


Link to post
47 minutes ago, itimpi said:

Windows will authenticate with whatever is used for the first share you access on the server.   All subsequent accesses to the server will use those credentials regardless of what security is set for a share and whether you get prompted for credentials.   The order of access to shares is therefore critical if any are set to not be public!

This is the part that is always confusing. Windows networking basically assumes there will be only one credential used from one machine to another machine. Once it has established that credential, it won't use any other. When it fails to access a share which requires another credential, it throws up the login because it failed, but it doesn't actually do anything with that login.

 

One way you can fool Windows into using a different credential is to try accessing by IP instead of name (or by name if you were using IP). It keeps those credentials separately because it thinks of them as different machines it is trying to access.

Share this post


Link to post

And, of course, you can always just get rid of the credential in Control Panel - Credential Manager and it will have to start over with a new credential.

 

But, another thing to remember is that it will always try with the credentials of the current Windows user before it even asks. And if that succeeds, that becomes the credential used for all subsequent access.

Share this post


Link to post

The strange problem here is that i have access, then suddenly smb throws me a access denied when writing a lot of data to the array. SMB drops to a stall and then 30 seconds later it tries again and resumes operation.

 

I'm using a rather popular motherboard "X10SRL-F" from supermicro which i doubt has any compatability issues with unraid as it is used by many as far as i can tell.

 

Im going to have to do more testing before i can figure out exactly what whats going on, i'm no expert in smb but the verbose logging seems strange that first i start transferring a file and access is granted then mid stream suddenly smb alerts that access is denied and it resets. And it only occurs after transfering a rather large amount of random data. Never happened during a smaller transfer of like 5gb of data. More likely to occur around 100gb of data transfer.

Edited by je82

Share this post


Link to post
3 hours ago, je82 said:

I have now hardcoded 2 entries into my credentials vault in the windows machine sending the files, my idea is that windows smb is randomly for whatever reason authenticating with the wrong credentials resulting in a read/write error, the strange thing is this did not occur as far as i can tell with my old unraid installation which i did send over 200gb of files via smb to.

Be careful having multiple credentials to the same server.  As pointed out SMB will allow only one computer/user connection at a time.  If you want to read more about this whole feature/issue/problem look here:
 

     https://forums.unraid.net/topic/25064-user-share-problem/?tab=comments#comment-228392

 

Read from this post on and the next several posts contain more examples of gotchas!

 

I think basically, the idea was that each computer/user would log onto a server once and that login should be transparent to the average user.  (Think of the 'average user' as being the checkout person at your local hardware store.) Then the administrator of the server would assign access privileges to every share of the server  to every user as required.  Basically, this will work until you want  a 'super user' who has to be able access to everything occasionally.  Then you have a problem as you can't logout from SMB except from the command line!  So once, the super user has logged in, the computer/user will always be the 'super user' unless you jump through loops.  (I believe you can establish a series of user logins on a single computer which will allow different access credentials for each 'user' but this is a kludge of a solution with the reboot time of Windows.)

 

To have Windows 'forget' the current credentials that it is using, you can use the following command:

net use * /delete

That should allow one to log on using different set of credentials.  

 

But at this point, I don't think this is your problem.  I am wondering if this might not be related to this issue:

 

    https://forums.unraid.net/bug-reports/stable-releases/67x-very-slow-array-concurrent-performance-r605/

 

Share this post


Link to post
2 hours ago, Frank1940 said:

Be careful having multiple credentials to the same server.  As pointed out SMB will allow only one computer/user connection at a time.  If you want to read more about this whole feature/issue/problem look here:
 

     https://forums.unraid.net/topic/25064-user-share-problem/?tab=comments#comment-228392

 

Read from this post on and the next several posts contain more examples of gotchas!

 

I think basically, the idea was that each computer/user would log onto a server once and that login should be transparent to the average user.  (Think of the 'average user' as being the checkout person at your local hardware store.) Then the administrator of the server would assign access privileges to every share of the server  to every user as required.  Basically, this will work until you want  a 'super user' who has to be able access to everything occasionally.  Then you have a problem as you can't logout from SMB except from the command line!  So once, the super user has logged in, the computer/user will always be the 'super user' unless you jump through loops.  (I believe you can establish a series of user logins on a single computer which will allow different access credentials for each 'user' but this is a kludge of a solution with the reboot time of Windows.)

 

To have Windows 'forget' the current credentials that it is using, you can use the following command:


net use * /delete

That should allow one to log on using different set of credentials.  

 

But at this point, I don't think this is your problem.  I am wondering if this might not be related to this issue:

 

    https://forums.unraid.net/bug-reports/stable-releases/67x-very-slow-array-concurrent-performance-r605/

 

It may look similar but my smb only slows to a complete halt... then waits for around 10-15 seconds, then it resumes at 110mb/s again... speeds are fine, its just that it seems to become unresponsive at random times.

 

It is definitely not the network, it responds quickly via web interface while smb is timing out and also pinging the unraid server results in constant 1ms ping times.

 

I turned of smb logging as it was eating usb memory fast. I cannot confirm but it appears to happen whenever a file has completed transfer and a new file is being created to transfer, at that moment sometimes it becomes unresponsive.

 

I'll do more testing this weekend when i have some more time to spend on it.

Share this post


Link to post

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Restore formatting

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.