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jonp

Welcome to Unraid.net

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I stumbled across the new forum site on my Android tablet using Chrome, and had to log in, but of course had forgotten my password. So I tried to recover the password and found that I had also forgotten the email I signed up with. The frustrating problem is that there's a screen that allows you to enter a new email address, but a) the text is unreadable because it seems to be white on white and b) it seems - if I squint very hard, that the letters entered are randomly added to the text box.
 
Now on retrying this morning, the text is a not much better very light grey on light pink, and squinting shows that the text entry seems to be OK.
 
(I'm on the forum now because fortunately Chrome on my PC remembered the password.)
Don't seem to have those problems on my Nexus 6 using chrome. Also not sure what you're talking about entering a new email address. Here's what I see.

0b0eccbddfe0d5b25eb5d8d44bfc4316.jpg
1bb5c6aad158420066cc71191ea4a088.jpg

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Thank YOU for the amount of work and quality you put into unraid, I am constantly hassling all my friends to get their own rig. In every relevant usecase I am constantly met with "woah!", "you can do WHAT?!", "seriously??","this is so easy","I'm in love".  

It has been massively usefull for me professionally as I pretty much use unraid as my personal lab, even my colleagues borrows it for most of their lab needs. 

We're currently planning a monster rig to use internally for this purpose. 

 

New look is great, can't wait to see what the future holds! 

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@Abnorm If your signature is correct (perhaps you have not updated your sig in a while?), you are running a very old version of unRAID OS.  If that is correct, I am curious if there is a reason why you are still running a beta release of the original 6.0?  Is it just a matter of, "if it aint broke, don't fix it"  or, some other reason?

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5 hours ago, Hoopster said:

@Abnorm If your signature is correct (perhaps you have not updated your sig in a while?), you are running a very old version of unRAID OS.  If that is correct, I am curious if there is a reason why you are still running a beta release of the original 6.0?  Is it just a matter of, "if it aint broke, don't fix it"  or, some other reason?

Super old sig, thanks for pointing that out :)
I'll stay pretty much on the newest stable release available, with all the security patches and such. 

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the 6.6.0 rc1 is available

plugin: downloading: https://s3.amazonaws.com/dnld.lime-technology.com/next/unRAIDServer-6.6.0-rc1-x86_64.zip

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Try the forum feedback board. Info in there.

Where is the theme switcher? I don't want a black background...


Sent from my Nexus 6 using Tapatalk

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Thanks jonp. You should probably get a link added to Forum settings page to change a theme (https://forums.unraid.net/settings/). The current location is very obscure.
That's why it's pinned under forum feedback. ;-)

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Is it just me or has the UNRAID website been dumbed down to the point where virtually no detailed information is given about the product? Sure the website looks great but if I was wanting to get some details of how it works I'd be leaving disappointed.

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Is it just me or has the UNRAID website been dumbed down to the point where virtually no detailed information is given about the product? Sure the website looks great but if I was wanting to get some details of how it works I'd be leaving disappointed.

If it's not obvious enough, the technical info behind Unraid is actually documented in the wiki (documentation). I think there are actually multiple links to it on the site for more info.

 

Edit: yup, there are multiple call outs to explaining the product in great detail:

 

https://wiki.unraid.net/UnRAID_6/Overview

 

What I might do is make the links on the product page for our 3 core capabilities (storage, apps, and VMs) go directly to those sections of the docs instead of the index of the wiki.

 

That said, 99% of our web traffic comes from folks that had already heard about us through some other source (a friend, another website, YouTube, etc). This means most folks visiting probably know the basics about us, but might be interested in knowing the different things they can do with the OS as opposed to how it works. That's why we switched the main site to being focused on what you can do with it.

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9 minutes ago, jonp said:

If it's not obvious enough, the technical info behind Unraid is actually documented in the wiki (documentation). I think there are actually multiple links to it on the site for more info.

Sent from my Nexus 6 using Tapatalk
 

I understand the links to the wiki are there as you mention. However, for the uninitiated I wouldn't expect to have to dig through often out of date or incomplete documentation just to find out the core features of a product. From my perspective, documentation tells me how to use a product, the product website should sell me the features first. 

 

While the old site was less pretty it was quite comprehensive in explaining in relatively broad detail exactly what the product did.

Edited by TheMantis

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I understand the links to the wiki are there as you mention. However, for the uninitiated I wouldn't expect to have to dig through often out of date or incomplete documentation just to find out the core features of a product. From my perspective, documentation tells me how to use a product, the product website should sell me the features first. This is just an observation.
I totally get it. Probably something for us to look at for future iterations on the site. Like I said before, it's not a huge priority because no one just randomly types in "unraid.net" to find us. Most are referred from others who have already explained the basics to them.

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Oh and its worth noting that fully updating the documentation is on the to do list. :-)

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3 minutes ago, jonp said:

Oh and its worth noting that fully updating the documentation is on the to do list. 🙂

Sent from my Nexus 6 using Tapatalk
 

Great, I'd imagine that with the constant addition of amazing features, keeping the documentation up to date would be quite an effort. 

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10 hours ago, TheMantis said:

I'd imagine that with the constant addition of amazing features, keeping the documentation up to date would be quite an effort. 

Documentation and coding (feature updates) should be handled with equl priority. If there´s not enough time for updating documentation, one should slow down development.

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3 hours ago, hocky said:

Documentation and coding (feature updates) should be handled with equl priority. If there´s not enough time for updating documentation, one should slow down development.

Wholeheartedly disagree.

 

Even tech giants don't have enough resource to update their documentation (google "MMCSS core limit" and see where that is documented by Microsoft in any sort of wiki), it is highly unreasonable to expect that to happen with unRAID.

 

I can see many reasons why updating the documentation / wiki should NOT be on the same priority as adding features and fixing bugs:

  • Spaceinvader One youtube channel already has excellent guides that are both highly specific and way easier to follow than any wiki is gonna be.
  • Are you telling me that unRAID should stop development on Ryzen / Threadripper support so that NVMe support is properly documented down?
  • People hardly ever read the wiki, judging by the number of times "attach diagnostics" is the first response to posts about problems.
  • This forum has a ton of resource (e.g. the various FAQs) that is pretty useful for anyone that bother to read up. If one does not bother to read the FAQs in the forum then it's pretty safe to assume one wouldn't bother to read any other documentation anyway.
  • The unRAID interface already has the Help button (hint: upper right corner) and the information provided is already pretty self-explanatory for basic builds.
  • The pace of features being added (officially and unofficially) is absolutely THE selling point of unRAID (for me at least). Many times, features are available before official support is in place (i.e. through the GUI) so it's in the "try at your own risks" category.  Multiple cache pool? Yep. Emulator core pinning? Yep. Memory restriction for dockers? Yep. Sparse vdisk image? Yep.
  • A lot of unRAID features are extension from Linux, KVM, qemu etc. If one reads the documentations of those, one can draw a lot of parallel and apply to unRAID. Oh wait, nobody reads them and/or they don't exist.

 

Documentation should be updated but it's like my conversation with my boss last week along the line of "Hey boss, I only have 8 hours a day, 5 days a week. Do you want me to do real work or do you want me to document what people are already doing anyway?"

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Your bullet-list is already a statement for having proper documentation in one place: atm, documentation is scattered in multiple places and it´s up to the user to find it.

If the user finds it, chances are that the piece of information he found is outdated/doesn´t fit to the version he uses. 

Saving effort for documentation on developer side just pushes the effort to the user (and is multiplied there).

 

16 minutes ago, testdasi said:

Do you want me to do real work or do you want me to document what people are already doing anyway?

I don´t say that it´s neccessarily the developer himself who should do the documentation. On the contrary, often it´s best not to let the developer document what he´s created if you want people to understand it. ;-)

20 minutes ago, testdasi said:

Many times, features are available before official support is in place (i.e. through the GUI) so it's in the "try at your own risks" category.

That´s fine for me if it´s advertised as such. If it´s converting to a standard feature, that´s a different story.

21 minutes ago, testdasi said:

Even tech giants don't have enough resource to update their documentation (google "MMCSS core limit" and see where that is documented by Microsoft in any sort of wiki),

I´m hearing what you´re saying, but that doesn´t make it better. 

I understand that most people demand to have the latest and greatest feature and spend hours in finding out how it works, rather than having the existing features properly documented. I would prefer the latter. Call me old-fashioned. :-)

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Should limetech increase the size of their very small paid staff and pass the costs on to their users so documentation that many won't read gets done?

 

Or should they let their enthusiastic user community work for free to help other users understand Unraid and solve problems?

 

 

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45 minutes ago, trurl said:

Should limetech increase the size of their very small paid staff 

Why should they? They know they have a "enthusiastic user community work for free" :-)

45 minutes ago, trurl said:

help other users understand Unraid and solve problems?

In my opinion, the community could reduce effort on the first and focus more on the latter with a bit better documentation in the background.

But i know i´m on lost post with my opinion, so i´ll leave it for now.

 

EDIT: Oh, and since jonp already mentioned above that updating the documentation is on the to-do-list, everything should be fine. :-)

Edited by hocky

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When a new feature is added, there is also associated Help text included in the GUI. The Help text should give the user a basic understanding of how to use and configure the feature. It is not a full fletched explanatory as a wiki can be, but certainly is helpful ;)

 

Often I get the impression however that people do not consult the Help text at all.

 

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2 hours ago, hocky said:

Your bullet-list is already a statement for having proper documentation in one place: atm, documentation is scattered in multiple places and it´s up to the user to find it.

If the user finds it, chances are that the piece of information he found is outdated/doesn´t fit to the version he uses. 

 

I do agree that things are not indexed well or centralized.  It's ok to have info in different places so long as there is a single place that links to all of it.  This is something we'll work to improve on going forward.

 

2 hours ago, hocky said:

I understand that most people demand to have the latest and greatest feature and spend hours in finding out how it works, rather than having the existing features properly documented. I would prefer the latter. Call me old-fashioned. 🙂

Our view is very simple:  without the feature, there is nothing to document.  This isn't a chicken and egg problem.  It's 100% that the feature has to come first, then the docs can follow.  That said, I do agree that we could be doing a better job on centralizing documentation and expanding it a bit more.  This is an area we are actively working on right now.

 

1 hour ago, trurl said:

Should limetech increase the size of their very small paid staff and pass the costs on to their users so documentation that many won't read gets done?

 

Or should they let their enthusiastic user community work for free to help other users understand Unraid and solve problems?

We're actually doing a little of both.  We've been increasing our contracting efforts to spread the work out more and thankfully we have a large community of folks to pull from ;-).

 

10 minutes ago, bonienl said:

Often I get the impression however that people do not consult the Help text at all.

Amen brother!  That said, I also think the way we do help could use some improvement.  It's not as intuitive as it could be, but that's a problem to solve on another day.

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14 hours ago, jonp said:

I do agree that things are not indexed well or centralized.  It's ok to have info in different places so long as there is a single place that links to all of it.  This is something we'll work to improve on going forward.

Sounds good. I´m not requesting a book that could be read as a novel before going to bed ;-) Tieing it all together and keeping it up-to-date is more or less editorial work that doesn´t require to actually write large pieces of text.

14 hours ago, jonp said:

It's 100% that the feature has to come first, then the docs can follow.  That said, I do agree that we could be doing a better job on centralizing documentation and expanding it a bit more.  This is an area we are actively working on right now.

Again, sounds good. If you´re eager to use a brand-new, but more or less undocumented feature you´re good to go. If you prefer to have a documentation on the feature (like me), you just have to wait a bit. However, the "bit" has to be predicatable (at least to some degree).

14 hours ago, jonp said:

We've been increasing our contracting efforts to spread the work out more and thankfully we have a large community of folks to pull from ;-).

And again: sounds good. :-) :-)

So i understand there are a couple of activities pointing into the right direction.

 

I´d like to emphasize that i´m pretty new to UNRAID and that i like what i see. I´m critizing because i like the product and would like to see it improve further, not for bashing. 

Edited by hocky
typo

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