Advice before I start, please

[adgilcan]

Hi All

 

I have recently been through a major house renovation and am now turning my attention to the living room.

 

I have for some time had a very unsatisfactory experience with playing Blu-Ray movies from a Thecus NAS server (RAID 6, I think) and have been thoroughly researching an adequate alternative - hence I stumbled upon unRaid.

 

My current setup is a house with hardwired CAT6 cabling to all rooms, a Draytek Vigor G2240 24 port Gigabit switch, a Thecus N7700 NAS and a QNAP NMP-1000 Media Player.  The problem is that although all components claim to have Gigabit ethernet connections, Blu-Ray movies commonly stutter and freeze when served over the network.  BluRay movies played directly from the HDD of the NMP-1000 play just fine so there appears to be a bandwidth problem somewhere.

 

I have just ordered all the bits for a major unRaid server based around the Supermicro C2SEA motherboard.

 

I wondered if you wise people could tell me where they think my current problems may be coming from, and how to eliminate them in my new set-up.  It is my intention to completely do away with physical CDs, DVDs and BDs.  Thus literally hundreds of movies and music albums will be consigned to the attic.  But the system needs to work and work well.  I believe I have overspec'd the setup but I want to make sure there are no bottlenecks.

 

Power Supply Corsair CMPSU-850TXV2UK Case Lian Liu PC-A77F 5-in-3 drive bay Raidsonic IcyBox Motherboard SuperMicro C2SEA SATA Controller1 Adaptec Adaptec RAID 1430SA SATA Controller2 Adaptec Adaptec RAID 1220SA RAM Crucial Crucial 2x 2Gb CPU Intel Core 2 Quad Q8400 4 x 2.66Ghz 4MB Cache 1333 FSB Quad Core Processor CPU Fan Zalman Zalman CNPS10X QUIET Hard Drives WD WD20EARX

 

I have currently dumped the QNAP NMP-1000 in favour of a two year old Macmini which is running Plex media server.  However I still get the problem with BluRay movies.  I would like to build or buy a good quality media player capable of doing justice to my unRaid server and also able to act as a TiVo.  Does anyone have any recommendations here?

 

So, I would be really grateful if anyone could suggest why I am currently having problems playing my Bluray movies, whether they think my unRaid system will solve it or whether I will need to take additional steps, and what I should do to provide a front end in the form of a media player - build or buy?

 

I have built several computers in the past but never a server, and am not an expert in the finer details.

 

Very many thanks

 

 

 

 

[Joe L.]

unRAID does not use "raid" disk controllers in any "raid" mode.  Did you verify that unRAID will support the two you've ordered in a bunch-of-disks mode?

[adgilcan]

Hi Joe

 

Are you referring to the Adaptec RAID 1430SA controllers?  If so I chose them precisely because they are the ones used by Lime-Technology on their pre-built server MD-1510.  Apparently the BIOS can disable the RAID controlling function.  I could have spent more money and gone for 6Gb/s motherboard and controllers but I read somewhere that 3Gb/s is more than fast enough for media streaming and also I was worried that I might step outside solid compatibility.  Is that not so?

 

ATB

[Johnm]

If you already ordered the parts, then it is not quite "Advice before I start, please".

 

I would have suggested much newer , power efficient hardware that costs less.

 

But, if you already are at this point, I guess the next step to start building the server once it arrives and go from there.

 

as far as the HTPC, I would think mac mini should be ideal (other then finding a good remote).

I have a 2010 mini that has never hiccuped at any HD content yet. I use XBMC not Plex. but I am thinking about switching.

 

I guess the question is what format are your 1080p movies in now? ISO or MKVs?

[Joe L.]

Hi Joe

 

Are you referring to the Adaptec RAID 1430SA controllers?  If so I chose them precisely because they are the ones used by Lime-Technology on their pre-built server MD-1510.  Apparently the BIOS can disable the RAID controlling function.  I could have spent more money and gone for 6Gb/s motherboard and controllers but I read somewhere that 3Gb/s is more than fast enough for media streaming and also I was worried that I might step outside solid compatibility.  Is that not so?

 

ATB

I stream media with an old PCI based motherboard.  It can do, at best, 133Mb/s.  I think you'll be fine.

[adgilcan]

If you already ordered the parts, then it is not quite "Advice before I start, please".

 

I would have suggested much newer , power efficient hardware that costs less.

 

Well, you are right, of course.  I did spend a considerable amount of time trying to research what would be best but came back to the conclusion that sheer performance wasn't an issue but reliability was.  Therefore, I pretty much based the system around the MD-1510.  I could, however, still send the components back, so please feel free to make your suggestions.  My number one priority, though, is to have a system my wife can use and not have any issues with

 

I guess the question is what format are your 1080p movies in now? ISO or MKVs?

 

The movies are ripped using DVDFab and stored in a BDMV folder and (I think) played from the STREAM subfolder on .m2ts files.  I am not at all familiar with the best way to store and stream BD but apart from the stuttering problem this works fine.  Is there a better way to store a 1080p movie, preserving the video and 5.1 audio quality whilst stripping out the adverts and other unwanted trailers etc?

[lionelhutz]

Personally, it sounds like you have a networking issue that won't be solved by simply moving the network cable to a new storage box. Thecus makes good boxes so that Thecus box shouldn't be causing any streaming issues itself. You need to troubleshoot your network.

[joshpond]

Personally, it sounds like you have a networking issue that won't be solved by simply moving the network cable to a new storage box. Thecus makes good boxes so that Thecus box shouldn't be causing any streaming issues itself. You need to troubleshoot your network.

Agreed with this.

 

I've found in my setup streaming issues with BD.iso came down to two things. Network issue (wiring in the wall) and the player. An AC Ryan Play On wouldn't play BD.iso without stuttering. I believe the network chip in them are a bit rubbishy.

 

I run unraid to a popcorn hour c200. Better WAF than most things but even then took a while to get stable. The c200 connects at fast ethernet speed, not gigabit and still streams fine.

 

Josh

[adgilcan]

Thank you for your thoughts fellas.

 

I have worried about the networking issue myself in the past.  However I had the problem before the property renovation started when the Thecus NAS was connected directly to the QNAP media centre by a direct CAT5 cable.

 

Since the renovation, which was undertaken by professional electricians and not myself, the problem has remained and I now have CAT6 cables installed.  I can't quite see how it is the physical infrasrructure that is at fault.  It may be the way I have implemented RAID on the Thecus but I can't see how anything else can be at fault.  I may well be wrong, of course.

 

If you have any suggestions as to how I should investigate, I'd be pleased to hear them.  I do have a Synology single drive NAS I am not using and I suppose I could hook that up and see how it performs, however I think one of the best ways will be to build the unRaid server and see if the problem remains.

 

Thanks again for your thoughts.

[Joe L.]

Since the renovation, which was undertaken by professional electricians and not myself, the problem has remained and I now have CAT6 cables installed. 

There are two different "standards" for wiring an RJ45 connector.  One for telephone use, the other for LAN use.

If you use the wrong one when installing the wiring, performance will suffer greatly.

 

My personal RJ45 crimping tool has the color-code on the lid of its case.  Unfortunately, it shows the one for telephone use.  If the "professional electrician" used that wiring scheme thinking it was the correct wiring, your LAN would be wired wrong.

 

Basically, do not trust the "professional electrician" and their wiring of your LAN.  In the same way, if you are using pre-made patch cables, verify they are for LAN use.

[joshpond]

I have worried about the networking issue myself in the past.  However I had the problem before the property renovation started when the Thecus NAS was connected directly to the QNAP media centre by a direct CAT5 cable.

 

Probably the QNap media center network card. With the AC Ryan Playon hd it is also stutters on bluray but the popcorn hours that I have don't. I remember googling at some stage and it had issues to do with the network chip used and resources/bandwith or something like that.

 

Josh

[adgilcan]

There are two different "standards" for wiring an RJ45 connector.  One for telephone use, the other for LAN use.

If you use the wrong one when installing the wiring, performance will suffer greatly.

 

I am aware of "T568A" and "T568B" wiring for LAN cables.  I am not aware of a difference in performance, merely of protocol.

 

The following is posted from Wikipedia, referring to the wiring method used for CAT6 cables: "Connectors use either T568A or T568B pin assignments; the choice is arbitrary provided both ends of a cable are the same."

 

I don't understand your statement.  Are you able to tell me the colour of the pin 1 wire for the method you recommend?  It should be either white/orange or white/green.

 

 

 

 

[Joe L.]

There are two different "standards" for wiring an RJ45 connector.  One for telephone use, the other for LAN use.

If you use the wrong one when installing the wiring, performance will suffer greatly.

 

I am aware of "T568A" and "T568B" wiring for LAN cables.  I am not aware of a difference in performance, merely of protocol.

 

The following is posted from Wikipedia, referring to the wiring method used for CAT6 cables: "Connectors use either T568A or T568B pin assignments; the choice is arbitrary provided both ends of a cable are the same."

 

I don't understand your statement.  Are you able to tell me the colour of the pin 1 wire for the method you recommend?  It should be either white/orange or white/green.

Those two variants are simply differences in which color pairs are used for the pins.  Electrically, they are identical.

 

I'm referring to the telephone standard which uses entirely different pins for the pairs.    It is the one shown on the cover of my crimping tool.  ( known as USOC RJ61 )

and shown on this page below those for the 568A and 568B wiring:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category_5_cable

A LAN connection wired like this would be really bad, if it worked at all.

[joshpond]

The other thing you could try is use NFS or even HTTP for the networking over SMB. If you see a slight improvement then like I said I suspect the QNAP ethernet port might not be up to it. Just because it is gigabit doesn't mean it is the same as gigabit on a PC.

 

Josh

[ubuntuaddicted]

may sound silly but are you positive all NIC's are in full-duplex mode?

 

(also to the person talking about color wire configurations for terminating ethernet cables, I didn't know better when i was wiring up my house with cat6e and a networking friends came over and said, the coloring of wires means nothing as long as both ends of the cable are the same. he promptly terminated 12 connectors without following any color code but he did ensure he followed the same color pattern for every cable he terminated. does this sound weird?)

[dgaschk]

Your friend is wrong. It may work but performance will suffer.

[adgilcan]

... a networking friends came over and said, the coloring of wires means nothing as long as both ends of the cable are the same. he promptly terminated 12 connectors without following any color code but he did ensure he followed the same color pattern for every cable he terminated. does this sound weird?)

 

He is definitely wrong.

 

It is all to do with reducing crosstalk in the cable.  You will notice that some pairs are twisted together (hence the name "twisted pair").  If you have done any wiring yourself, you will have noticed that you have to untwist a pair and retwist them with a contrary pair just prior to connecting them.  This is all to do with interference.

 

I'm referring to the telephone standard which uses entirely different pins for the pairs.

 

Thank you Joe.  Yes , we are not referring to that protocol and my professional friends wired the installation up to an exceptionally high standard (and I am an ex-electrician).  We have over 2.5 Km Cat6 wiring and 5 Km 240v cable in the installation, all shielded, fire rated and laid neatly in cable tray separately to specific, pink, Cat5e cable for the cBus control, and greased as an anti-vermin measure.  I know you didn't mean to insult them but you simply couldn't fault my installers.  I would willingly recommend them to anyone in SE England!

 

As it happens, I am confident that my speed issue relates to a problem with my NAS server.  I have been messing around today, whilst waiting for my bits to arrive, and found that the only equipment on my network that has speed issues is the Thecus NAS drive.  I think I need to give it a good service once I have emptied its contents onto my new unRaid machine.

 

My next issues will be setting up the server and deciding on the share allocation method.  But that is probably another thread.

 

Please don't feel put off from suggestions, though.

 

Thanks so much for your input so far.

[ubuntuaddicted]

Your friend is wrong. It may work but performance will suffer.

made a post, didn't want to hijack this thread  http://lime-technology.com/forum/index.php?topic=17170.0

[Joe L.]

Thank you Joe.  Yes , we are not referring to that protocol and my professional friends wired the installation up to an exceptionally high standard (and I am an ex-electrician).  We have over 2.5 Km Cat6 wiring and 5 Km 240v cable in the installation, all shielded, fire rated and laid neatly in cable tray separately to specific, pink, Cat5e cable for the cBus control, and greased as an anti-vermin measure.  I know you didn't mean to insult them but you simply couldn't fault my installers.  I would willingly recommend them to anyone in SE England!

I would never insult them, but even you will admit, there are electricians who know electrical work, and those who also know about LAN wiring.  (although these days, I imagine it is very common to run cat5/6 wiring when doing new construction. )