I completely agree.

 Why not move all the ports to one side, use SATA only power connectors insted of molex, and slap a 92mm (since a 120 is about 0.5 inches too big) on the back?

 

That is one thing that intrigues me about the Norco models is that all the ports ARE on one side:

 

http://www.newegg.com/Product/ImageGallery.aspx?CurImage=16-133-030-TS&SpinSet=16-133-030-RS&ISList=16-133-030-Z01,16-133-030-Z02,16-133-030-Z03,16-133-030-Z04,16-133-030-Z05&S7ImageFlag=1&Item=N82E16816133030&Depa=0&WaterMark=1&Description=NORCO%20SS-500%205%20Bay%20SATA%20/%20SAS%20Hot%20Swap%20Rack%20Module

 

Seems with a little dremel work, you could easily put on a larger fan on that cools all the drives. I might try if Newegg ever gives them free shipping....

Do you prefer trays or trayless?  Trayless tend to cost a bit more, but no screwdriver is needed for drive installation.

 

As for a general recommendation, I would go with...

 

SNT SNT-SAC3051TL 5 x 3.5" HDD in 3 x 5.25" Bay SAS/SATA Trayless Backplane Hot Swap RAID Cage

 

...as it is a good design and it is one of the cheapest on the market.  The fans on the back are tiny and may be a bit loud, but they are easily removable.  Looking at the pictures of your case on Newegg I'm fairly certain that this drive cage will just slide right in, but if there are any ledges between the 5.25" bays you will have to flatten those with pliers and a hammer.

 

If you prefer trays, Icy Dock and Norco have good options.

 

Hi Rajahal,

I honestly don't care if the new cages have trays or not. The big PITA now is that to change one drive I have to take the whole cage out. In contrast just swapping a drive on a tray sounds very appealing.

 

Reliability and noise are the main consideration. We have no air con but temperature in the house rarely goes over 30C. In the current configuration (Coolermaster STB-3T4-E3-GP cages), the max drive temps I've seen are around 44-45C, but most of the time they're under 40-41C.

From what I've seen, the highest you want your drives running for any lengthy amount of time is 40C or under.  My drives currently are in a 4 - 3 bracket with a 120 in front, and the 7200rpm models don't go above 34C during a preclear.

From what I've seen, the highest you want your drives running for any lengthy amount of time is 40C or under.  My drives currently are in a 4 - 3 bracket with a 120 in front, and the 7200rpm models don't go above 34C during a preclear.

 

I realize that, which is why I was thinking that maybe a 4-in-3 cage would give me a better chance to keep the drives under 40C. I'm curious what's the temp in your house if the drives stay so cool?

I get drive temps similar to yours when the house is around 20C, but not in the summer. 

That is one thing that intrigues me about the Norco models is that all the ports ARE on one side...

 

Seems with a little dremel work, you could easily put on a larger fan on that cools all the drives. I might try if Newegg ever gives them free shipping....

Yes, but they are on the bottom instead of on the side of the back, so you have limited room for a larger fan.  The other problem is knowing what the board looks like behind the frame.  But so far, that is the most minimized port configuration I've seen.  Why can't they all do that?

In that case, luca, I would go with either IcyDock or Supermicro.  I would probably go with the SuperMicro due to the lower price, unless you really like the looks of the IcyDock.  Quality-wise they are the same (or at least very very close).  Both brands carry respect.  They both use larger fans which should be plenty quiet, and the fans are removable/replaceable if you aren't satisfied with the stock fans.  Both models are well vetted in these forums.

 

Aiden - the max drive temp is a bit of a contentious issue, but my cutoff is 45 C.  Most manufacturers list 50 C, so I say 45 just to be safe.  If one or two of my drives went between 40 and 45 C during a parity check or some temporary situation like that I wouldn't worry about it.  I agree that the 30s are ideal for day-to-day operation, though.

 

My green drives run around 34 C or less, even during a parity check in the summer.  My older 7200 rpm drives run in the high 30s or sometimes low 40s.

I realize that, which is why I was thinking that maybe a 4-in-3 cage would give me a better chance to keep the drives under 40C. I'm curious what's the temp in your house if the drives stay so cool?

I get drive temps similar to yours when the house is around 20C, but not in the summer. 

LOL... I live in Texas, so today it was 40.5 C.    In the house, it never gets above 24 C, because we have to have A/C here.

Aiden - the max drive temp is a bit of a contentious issue, but my cutoff is 45 C.  Most manufacturers list 50 C, so I say 45 just to be safe.  If one or two of my drives went between 40 and 45 C during a parity check or some temporary situation like that I wouldn't worry about it.  I agree that the 30s are ideal for day-to-day operation, though.

I completely agree it's more of a personal comfort level than an exact number.  However, I would postulate the 5 platter Hitachis generate more internal heat than the 4 platter green drives.  And FWIW, when I preclear it takes a week, because I usually run 3 cycles.  That's a long time to be at the upper end of the heat spectrum on a brand new drive, which is why I want to try to keep things in the 30s when I finally find a cage I like.

 

Has anyone used these?  I'm wondering if putting the fan in front has any impact versus the back.

Has anyone used these?  I'm wondering if putting the fan in front has any impact versus the back.

 

Seems like Icy Dock's these:

 

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817993002

Has anyone used these?  I'm wondering if putting the fan in front has any impact versus the back.

 

Huh, interesting, I haven't seen those before.  I imagine they would make the case a bit louder since the fan wouldn't be muffled from the outside at all, but other than that...I don't know.

I used 2 of the 4 drive versions of cages similar to these;

 

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16816215176&cm_re=istarusa-_-16-215-176-_-Product

 

Note this one has little drive power buttons down the one side. Overall, mine work well and keep the drives fairly close to the ambient room temperature.

 

I eventually ended up taking the back off and cutting the "grill" out and then installing a different 80mm fan on the outside blowing into each cage. My case fans blow into the case and then the air is blown out through the drives. My server is in my unfinished basement so I did that with filters on the fans to help keep dirt and bugs and such from getting into the drive bays. I was finding dust in the cages when running with the fans sucking air in from the front but now the drives remain clean.

 

The stock fan does move decent air but it's LOUD on high speed and loud on low speed.

 

One other thing to note is that they use these very flat headed phillips screws I've never seen anywhere else to hold the drives to the trays so you have to make sure you don't lose them. I haven't filled both of them yet so I just leave the bag with the extra screws in an empty drawer.

 

Peter

 

One other thing to note is that they use these very flat headed phillips screws I've never seen anywhere else to hold the drives to the trays so you have to make sure you don't lose them. I haven't filled both of them yet so I just leave the bag with the extra screws in an empty drawer.

This is just more reason for me to want to solidly plant myself in the trayless category.  I have too many screws in too many plastic baggies scattered amongst too many drawers. 

In the end I went with 3 Norco SS-400:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16816133035&Tpk=ss-400

I'll let you know how it works out.

One other thing to note is that they use these very flat headed phillips screws I've never seen anywhere else to hold the drives to the trays so you have to make sure you don't lose them. I haven't filled both of them yet so I just leave the bag with the extra screws in an empty drawer.

This is just more reason for me to want to solidly plant myself in the trayless category.  I have too many screws in too many plastic baggies scattered amongst too many drawers. 

 

I meant in one of the empty disk trays so they're not going anywhere.

 

Peter

In the end I went with 3 Norco SS-400:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16816133035&Tpk=ss-400

I'll let you know how it works out.

 

Looks like the exact same trays that are in the Norco 4220, so they should be interchangeable should you ever end up with one of those cases.  You'll likely find that the inside of each tray has a small sliding metal grate that can be used to shut off airflow through that tray when it is not in use - very handy.  I just hope it isn't the same double-thickness 80mm fan that is included with the 4220 - those suckers are loud!

No problem.  I think this is best explained visually.

 

However, if your server will be in a climate controlled environment with case fans and good airflow, then 5-in-3's are the better option.

 

Thanks Rajahal for explaining this.

 

Can you tell me if these drive cages will be compatible with the new SATA Revision 3.0 (SATA 6 Gb/s).

Can you tell me if these drive cages will be compatible with the new SATA Revision 3.0 (SATA 6 Gb/s).

 

Hmm, good question.  I don't really know.  I believe that they should work since they are basically just pass through devices similar to SATA cables...and you don't need special SATA cables to use SATA III drives, right?

Can you tell me if these drive cages will be compatible with the new SATA Revision 3.0 (SATA 6 Gb/s).

 

Hmm, good question.  I don't really know.  I believe that they should work since they are basically just pass through devices similar to SATA cables...and you don't need special SATA cables to use SATA III drives, right?

 

I did some Googling and they say there are no difference between SATA 1,2 or 3 cables.

Looks like the exact same trays that are in the Norco 4220, so they should be interchangeable should you ever end up with one of those cases.  You'll likely find that the inside of each tray has a small sliding metal grate that can be used to shut off airflow through that tray when it is not in use - very handy.  I just hope it isn't the same double-thickness 80mm fan that is included with the 4220 - those suckers are loud!

 

Yes, those fans are LOUD.   A little follow up after having installed them in my Antec 900.

 

pros:

 

- sturdy built, power and SATA cables fit in nicely, front LED's, overheating alarm, fan failure sensor

 

- front plate on the tray that can slide to restrict air flow to the tray that have drives installed

 

- smooth tray drive inserting / ejecting

 

- cage has guide slots on the sides to allow for mounting in cases which have built-in supports on the sides for each 5.25" bay (Antec 900 for one)

 

- cooling: I think overall about 4-5C cooler than the Coolermaster STB-3T4-E3-GP that I was using before

 

 

cons:

 

- noisy 80mm fan: don't buy this cage unless you plan to replace the fans, or you're not going to be anywhere close to the server

 

- locking latch is plastic, but it's well designed and works well

 

- no SATA cables included: personally this was a plus, but some might want the extra cables

 

- this is a 4-in-3 cage, with a 5-in-3 you can squeeze an extra drive in

 

- no instructions at all: at least one tiny sticker, showing which SATA port corresponds to which tray, would have been nice 

 

I believe that the Norco are repackaged Chenbro units.

 

 

 

One thing I'll point out about the Icy's versus the Supermicro is the actual physical size.  The Supermicro are like a couple millimeters fatter which means you WILL be fighting to get them into the normal 5-in-3 bays.  The Icy's will fit MUCH MUCH easier.  

Another thing is the Supermicro's are noisy.  The Icy's are quiet out of the box.  Add the cost of new fans for the Supermicro's and it's a wash.

 

Another thing...some folks in this thread are stating that there will be hot spots based on fan placement.  If you are citing official tests or you have real personal experience with that particular unit then please indicate that.  Otherwise, those types of opinions are very subjective.

Another thing...some folks in this thread are stating that there will be hot spots based on fan placement.  If you are citing official tests or you have real personal experience with that particular unit then please indicate that.  Otherwise, those types of opinions are very subjective.

 

So, are you saying I can hope that the Enchance models I want are going to cool adequately, until I find a review that states otherwise?

Another thing...some folks in this thread are stating that there will be hot spots based on fan placement.  If you are citing official tests or you have real personal experience with that particular unit then please indicate that.  Otherwise, those types of opinions are very subjective.

 

So, are you saying I can hope that the Enchance models I want are going to cool adequately, until I find a review that states otherwise?

 

Well, hope springs eternal!  Until someone can get their hands on one and experiment or at least look at how the rack is laid out internally it is an unknown.  

I've boxed in harddrives in regular racks using cardboard and tape, using a small fan no where near the center of the box and they stayed cool.  Those are drives one above the other not turned on their sides.  In almost all cases each successive drive as they went up were 1c degree warmer.  If that occurs then no problem.  If they baffled the rack then there may not be any hot spots.  Can you turn the rack so that the fan is towards the top side?

A hot spot of consequence would be 10c higher.  I doubt that will be happening.

 

Hotspots happen on cpu's when the heatsink has gaps or isn't level.  Because the stuff inside the silicone is REALLY tiny it actually matters.  But hard drive surfaces aren't on the micro or nano scale.  Either the rack ventilation works or it doesn't.  In the ones Raj has it doesn't.  In many others it does.  Raj, there were reports on the internet about the problem, you just didn't research it before buying.  Kind of like the mini-ITX board you just bought. 

 

 

Raj, there were reports on the internet about the problem, you just didn't research it before buying.  Kind of like the mini-ITX board you just bought.  

 

Haha, very true.  I do make some rash decisions from time to time.  Luckily the mini-ITX board actually appears to be working just fine.  I'm doing some time tests on it now, but I think I've done enough already to rule out the nForce 400 series issues that are documented on other motherboards.

But hard drive surfaces aren't on the micro or nano scale. 

You may have been right about 40 years ago, but not today.  Hard disks today work on the nano scale.

 

The heads fly over the disk surface at a height of around 5 nanometers.

 

Quoting from this link:

http://www.tomshardware.com/picturestory/476-6-seagate-hard-drive.html

The dimensions of the head are impressive. With a width of less than a hundred nanometers and a thickness of about ten, it flies above the platter at a speed of up to 15,000 RPM, at a height that’s the equivalent of 40 atoms. If you start multiplying these infinitesimally small numbers, you begin to get an idea of their significance.

 

Consider this little comparison: if the read/write head were a Boeing 747, and the hard-disk platter were the surface of the Earth:

 

    * The head would fly at Mach 800

    * At less than one centimeter from the ground

    * And count every blade of grass

    * Making fewer than 10 unrecoverable counting errors in an area equivalent to all of Ireland.

 

      All the elements of the head are fabricated very much the same way as processors are. They are formed from wafers, using photolithography and deposition of appropriate materials.

 

and this one:

http://www.instantfundas.com/2010/02/interesting-hard-drive-facts-you.html

 

Heat is a MAJOR cause of hard disk errors.  Just think of the thermal expansion and contraction of the disks themselves.

 

Joe L.