SAMSUNG F4 HD204UI 2TB $94 with Free Ship Deal of the day 9/22

[bluewhale51]

Here is another deal on the Samsung F4 2tb with coupon $94 with free Deal of the day 9/22

 

I think its the deal of the day.  Rather than post a new thread i adjusted this one

 

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822152245&nm_mc=EMC-IGNEFL091410&cm_mmc=EMC-IGNEFL091410-_-EMC-091410-Index-_-InternalHardDrives-_-22152245-L012A

[BRiT]

General Warning: It's still unknown and early on the Advanced Format and Performance with this Samsung drive. There doesn't seem to be any jumpers to use and some drives come with 512 Byte sector emulation on while some types come with it off.

 

http://lime-technology.com/forum/index.php?topic=7773.0

http://lime-technology.com/forum/index.php?topic=7820.0

[ReKK]

How does this affect unRAID?

[prostuff1]

How does this affect unRAID?

 

unRAID does not natively support the Advanced Format drives.  With the new WD drives you can use them without the jumper but the speed can be severely degraded.  Once the jumper is installed the drives are usually good to go (short of a few instances were the drives become unusable).

 

SO... if there is no way to "set" the Samsung drives then performance may be hampered in unRAID

[rhubarb9999]

I have one formatting up as my parity drive right now.  I will report back as soon as it is done.

[dyrewolfe]

I have one formatting up as my parity drive right now.  I will report back as soon as it is done.

 

I have one pre-clearing at the moment. Almost exactly 24 hours in and 89% complete on the post-read. I'll post the results for it and the WD Caviar Black 2TB for comparison once it's completed.

[dyrewolfe]

Here are the pre-clear results.

 

First the Samsung HD204UI:

 

============================================================================

==

== Disk /dev/sda has been successfully precleared

==

== Ran 1 preclear-disk cycle

==

== Using :Read block size = 8225280 Bytes

== Last Cycle's Pre Read Time  : 6:39:54 (83 MB/s)

== Last Cycle's Zeroing time  : 6:01:37 (92 MB/s)

== Last Cycle's Post Read Time : 13:13:31 (42 MB/s)

== Last Cycle's Total Time    : 25:56:30

==

== Total Elapsed Time 25:56:30

==

== Disk Start Temperature: 27C

==

== Current Disk Temperature: 26C,

==

============================================================================

 

and the WDC WD2001FASS-00W2B0 that I pre-cleared a couple of days ago:

 

============================================================================

==

== Disk /dev/sda has been successfully precleared

==

== Ran 1 preclear-disk cycle

==

== Using :Read block size = 8225280 Bytes

== Last Cycle's Pre Read Time  : 5:42:33 (97 MB/s)

== Last Cycle's Zeroing time  : 5:10:40 (107 MB/s)

== Last Cycle's Post Read Time : 11:38:07 (47 MB/s)

== Last Cycle's Total Time    : 22:32:27

==

== Total Elapsed Time 22:32:27

==

== Disk Start Temperature: 37C

==

== Current Disk Temperature: 30C,

==

============================================================================

 

I don't have either one in the array yet. I'm still in the process of prepping drives before I put everything in place. The WDC will be my parity drive. Any recommendations for solid tests, benchmarks etc I can run on this drive(s) to get a good idea of how it will perform w/unRAID?

[Joe L.]

Basically, you've just done a benchmark of the two drives...and posted it for us to see.

 

Comparing the times needed to read and write and the overall speeds, the WD drive is the faster.

 

I think the WD is a 7200 RPM drive vs. the 5400 RPM Samsung, so use the WD as parity. (slowest Rotational speed drive involved in a "write" to the array dictates the overall "write" speed to the array.)  So, a 5400 RPM parity drive would slow down write to all drives that are  faster.

 

Joe L.

 

 

[dyrewolfe]

Thanks Joe. Posting the WD results was more informational than anything else. I was expecting it to be the faster of the two. Just wanted to see how the Samsung compared on the same rig. Probably a better comparison would be with one of the WD Green drives (which I don't own).

 

Anyhow, thoughts on this 4k sector Samsung based on the results posted? Or just throw it in, roll with it and see what happens?

[rhubarb9999]

My Samsung 2TB finished its parity set up last night and I can report that it is running fine.  I am getting 20-25Mb/sec transfer time, which is about average for my unRAID array (might be a little faster than normal).  The 2TB is replacing a 1.5TB Samsung (also 5400RPM I think).

 

I replaced a 750GB data drive with another 2TB this morning.  Should know how it handles in about 16 hours.

[dyrewolfe]

My Samsung seems to be working well for me also. I added it as a data disk and getting xfers of roughly 40MB/s.

[Orbi]

The new samsungs come standard with 512k emulation. No need for any jumper nor degraded performance. Less hassle than WD.

[BRiT]

Even if they have 512k emulation there's still the possible issue of performance because of alignment.

[KYThrill]

From every thing I saw with misaligned WD's, sequential read/write speeds and 512k and 4k random read speeds were almost unaffected.  However, 512K & 4k random write speeds suffered on the misaligned drives.  And since formatting is mostly a small write operation, it could take 2-3X as long to format the misaligned drives.  And from what I've read the reiserfs file system suffers the most from being misaligned (which is unRAID's file system).

 

So to me, that would be the real test of the F4, how long it takes to format the drive. However, pre-clear may be similar to format in that you are writing small pieces of data.  Since the preclear time on both your drives is similar, the Samsung may be okay in unRAID.

 

However, still be wary of the z4 version of the F4.  It was reported on a German site that a /z4 OEM model from Japan did not have 512k emulation.  I have seen US retailers selling the OEM /z4 versions now, so be careful of what you buy.

 

My only other concern is with the pre-clear elapsed times you posted.  I've seen other folks who posted times much slower than that.  However, my last pre-clear of a 1TB drive took under 8 hours.  However, I guess all the numbers do add up.  I guess it will just vary system to system.  My speeds were about 30% faster than your 2TB Black, and I was only doing 1 TB, so if you take 22.5 * .7 * .5 = 7.9 hours.  So my concern is that there would be some limitation in your hardware and/or unRAID's preclear operation (2 reads + write) that would still mask a misaligned drive if pre-clear speeds are used to judge its suitability.

 

But if preclear is an equal indicator as a format operation, then I would have expected your F4's preclear (in your system) to be between 35-44 hours if it were misaligned (based on your WD's performance).  So it looks very promising for the F4 with 512k emulation!  Now I'm wishing I had picked one up from NewEgg while they were on sale. 

[greybeard]

Now I'm wishing I had picked one up from NewEgg while they were on sale.

 

Might not be too late. Looks like eWiz has them for $95 with free shipping using the latest coupon code. Unfortunatly, you can only use the coupon one time. Thinking about getting one and then giving some relatives a call.

[KYThrill]

Now I'm wishing I had picked one up from NewEgg while they were on sale.

 

Might not be too late. Looks like eWiz has them for $95 with free shipping using the latest coupon code. Unfortunatly, you can only use the coupon one time. Thinking about getting one and then giving some relatives a call.

 

Yep, still too late.  I used my discount to by the Supermicro SATA card.

[bluewhale51]

I guess its the deal of the day for 9/22

 

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822152245

[KYThrill]

I guess its the deal of the day for 9/22

 

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822152245

 

Thanks for the heads up.  I'm in for one.  I really wanted to buy a couple, but I've only got unRAID plus and I'm already using 5 drives, so this will be six.  I've only got 1.5TB stored on my unRAID so far and this will put me at 6TB, so I'm not really desperate for the space either.

 

The money would probably be better spent on a UPS.

[loadme]

Here is another deal on the Samsung F4 2tb with coupon $94 with free Deal of the day 9/22

 

I think its the deal of the day.  Rather than post a new thread i adjusted this one

 

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822152245&nm_mc=EMC-IGNEFL091410&cm_mmc=EMC-IGNEFL091410-_-EMC-091410-Index-_-InternalHardDrives-_-22152245-L012A

 

 

WOW! This is quite a deal.

I expected the F4 to be a very good priced piece of hdd here in europe, because its only 92€ what makes it $124.

 

But this deal.. i couldn't believe it until .. well.

Congrats to all new owners.

[rhubarb9999]

I now have two running in my unRAID .. one data, one parity.

 

No issues.  Cool and quiet.  Speed is good.

[flips]

How should this drive be treated for power supply sizing?  It's 5400 rpm, but not green/eco.

 

The last part I need to buy for my first unraid build are the drives.  I'm thinking two 2TB drives, and then after I will copy over my data I will add one or two 1TB drives. 

 

These seem almost as fast as the blacks from the earlier post.  What's the time to pre-clear a 2tb wd green drive?  Any reason to not just get 2 of these instead of two WD green 2TB drives or use one of these for parity and a green for drive 1?  This would be my first Samsung drive I ever bought, so I don't have a lot of experience with the brand, tbh I didn't even know they made hard drives until reading through these forums.

 

Thanks.

[mbryanr]

How should this drive be treated for power supply sizing?  It's 5400 rpm, but not green/eco.

 

It is an EcoGreen.  F4EG HD204UI

http://www.samsung.com/global/business/hdd/productmodel.do?group=72&type=94&subtype=98&model_cd=552&ppmi=1219

 

http://www.samsung.com/us/business/semiconductor/newsView.do?news_id=1183

 

These seem almost as fast as the blacks from the earlier post.  What's the time to pre-clear a 2tb wd green drive?  Any reason to not just get 2 of these instead of two WD green 2TB drives or use one of these for parity and a green for drive 1?  This would be my first Samsung drive I ever bought, so I don't have a lot of experience with the brand, tbh I didn't even know they made hard drives until reading through these forums.

 

Thanks.

 

I still worry about the 4K alignment and wish Samsung had more info available.

 

@rhubarb:  do you have more read/write performance numbers?

 

[KYThrill]

How should this drive be treated for power supply sizing?  It's 5400 rpm, but not green/eco.

 

It is an EcoGreen.  F4EG HD204UI

http://www.samsung.com/global/business/hdd/productmodel.do?group=72&type=94&subtype=98&model_cd=552&ppmi=1219

 

http://www.samsung.com/us/business/semiconductor/newsView.do?news_id=1183

 

These seem almost as fast as the blacks from the earlier post.  What's the time to pre-clear a 2tb wd green drive?  Any reason to not just get 2 of these instead of two WD green 2TB drives or use one of these for parity and a green for drive 1?  This would be my first Samsung drive I ever bought, so I don't have a lot of experience with the brand, tbh I didn't even know they made hard drives until reading through these forums.

 

Thanks.

 

I still worry about the 4K alignment and wish Samsung had more info available.

 

@rhubarb:  do you have more read/write performance numbers?

 

 

I don't believe 4k is anything worth worrying about on these drives anymore.  Looking back through old posts, when the EARS drives were new, and people didn't know to jumper them, there were reports of preclear times of 64 and 75 hours.  This is exactly what I would expect for an unaligned 4k drive.

 

But now we have two users with them, and one reported a 24 hour preclear.  If the Samsung drives were not aligned, they too would have very long pre-clear times.

 

The only question would be how the Samsungs behave when multiple partitioned, which you would never do in unRAID, so it is irrelevant in this context.

[Joe L.]

How should this drive be treated for power supply sizing?  It's 5400 rpm, but not green/eco.

 

It is an EcoGreen.  F4EG HD204UI

http://www.samsung.com/global/business/hdd/productmodel.do?group=72&type=94&subtype=98&model_cd=552&ppmi=1219

 

http://www.samsung.com/us/business/semiconductor/newsView.do?news_id=1183

 

These seem almost as fast as the blacks from the earlier post.  What's the time to pre-clear a 2tb wd green drive?  Any reason to not just get 2 of these instead of two WD green 2TB drives or use one of these for parity and a green for drive 1?  This would be my first Samsung drive I ever bought, so I don't have a lot of experience with the brand, tbh I didn't even know they made hard drives until reading through these forums.

 

Thanks.

 

I still worry about the 4K alignment and wish Samsung had more info available.

 

@rhubarb:  do you have more read/write performance numbers?

 

 

I don't believe 4k is anything worth worrying about on these drives anymore.  Looking back through old posts, when the EARS drives were new, and people didn't know to jumper them, there were reports of preclear times of 64 and 75 hours.  This is exactly what I would expect for an unaligned 4k drive.

 

But now we have two users with them, and one reported a 24 hour preclear.  If the Samsung drives were not aligned, they too would have very long pre-clear times.

 

The only question would be how the Samsungs behave when partitioned, which you would never do in unRAID, so it is irrelevant in this context.

You don't specifically partition the disks in your unRAID server, but every one of the data disk most definitely is partitioned with a single partition starting at sector 63.  It is for that reason the jumper is needed.

 

You can see it yourself by typing:

fdisk -l /dev/sdX

where sdX is one of your data drives.

[KYThrill]

How should this drive be treated for power supply sizing?  It's 5400 rpm, but not green/eco.

 

It is an EcoGreen.  F4EG HD204UI

http://www.samsung.com/global/business/hdd/productmodel.do?group=72&type=94&subtype=98&model_cd=552&ppmi=1219

 

http://www.samsung.com/us/business/semiconductor/newsView.do?news_id=1183

 

These seem almost as fast as the blacks from the earlier post.  What's the time to pre-clear a 2tb wd green drive?  Any reason to not just get 2 of these instead of two WD green 2TB drives or use one of these for parity and a green for drive 1?  This would be my first Samsung drive I ever bought, so I don't have a lot of experience with the brand, tbh I didn't even know they made hard drives until reading through these forums.

 

Thanks.

 

I still worry about the 4K alignment and wish Samsung had more info available.

 

@rhubarb:  do you have more read/write performance numbers?

 

 

I don't believe 4k is anything worth worrying about on these drives anymore.  Looking back through old posts, when the EARS drives were new, and people didn't know to jumper them, there were reports of preclear times of 64 and 75 hours.  This is exactly what I would expect for an unaligned 4k drive.

 

But now we have two users with them, and one reported a 24 hour preclear.  If the Samsung drives were not aligned, they too would have very long pre-clear times.

 

The only question would be how the Samsungs behave when partitioned, which you would never do in unRAID, so it is irrelevant in this context.

You don't specifically partition the disks in your unRAID server, but every one of the data disk most definitely is partitioned with a single partition starting at sector 63.  It is for that reason the jumper is needed.

 

You can see it yourself by typing:

fdisk -l /dev/sdX

where sdX is one of your data drives.

 

I meant multiple partitions.  Every disc must have at least one partition or you can't store anything on it.  By two accounts now, the Samsung does not have the problems of the EARS drives.  The only question would be how it behaves with multiple partitions.

 

For example, jumper 7&8 on the WD fixes the alignment for a single partition, but not for two partitions.  Well, the Samsung is already "fixed" and it doesn't require any jumpers.  But is it still "fixed" if you add another partition?  Well, it doesn't matter in unRAID, because your data drive wouldn't have two partitions anyway.