NAS Posted June 5, 2009 Share Posted June 5, 2009 For various reasons I am looking to move away from monster 20 disk systems to small Atom based 5 or so based unRAID installs. My main drivers are heat, ease of build, parity action time, being able to commission full array at once negating the need for future expansion amongst others. Essentially every significant problem i have ever had with unRAID was either caused by or brought on by having so many disks in the system one component either breaks or starts acting up cause im in a tiny group of people who every used this component in such a big system. My system expands by about 1TB every month and its costing me too much in time speccing 20 diks boxes. I have never built or even touched an Atom based system before. The hardware I am hoping for may not even exist yet but heres my wish list. Cube or preferably 1-2U rack case for 5 disk. Trays would be nice but a logical fixed disk layout would do. Quiet cooling is essential. 80 plus PSU Silver+ Atom tiny all in one MB Non PCI bus (likely doesn't exist on new kit of this type anyway) GigE My hope is that I can cost in the complete system for < $400 excluding disks. Has anyone got any recommendations. Thanks in advance Link to comment
cwr Posted June 5, 2009 Share Posted June 5, 2009 not a bad idea the thing that kills the 20 disk systems is the parity check speed. there doesn't seem to be any good pcie cards supported in linux with alot of ports which means resorting to a few pci cards. once you throw that into the mix, ugh. Link to comment
WeeboTech Posted June 5, 2009 Share Posted June 5, 2009 I don't about smaller 5 disk based systems within that budget. However a board like this http://www.mini-box.com/Intel-Desktop-DG45FC-w-Intel-Pentium-Dual-Core-Desktop-Processor-E5200-CPU;jsessionid=0a0106521f431917e52e41fa423d87e183c00bb80466.e3eSc34RbhyRe34Pa38Ta3aKbNb0 can support 4 internal drives, 1 external. Couple with the Chenbro micro itx chassis and you have a nice lil system. http://www.logicsupply.com/products/es34069 If you want to go rack mount here is an option http://www.logicsupply.com/products/te_1160 I do remember bubbaq posting an eBay link to the norco unit which is a 5 disk based all in one system and it was within $400. I cannot find the link right now. Link to comment
NAS Posted June 5, 2009 Author Share Posted June 5, 2009 Nice cases Ive spent an hour os so looking at Atom MB and they fit the purpose perfectly except for one factor.... onboard SATA. I suspect one will be released that fits the bill but as far as i can see its not out yet. Well remembered about the BubbQ post. I dug it out and its one of these: http://www.norco.com.cn/en/Storage%20Array/NS-520.htm http://www.norco.cn/GorundNews_Show.asp?id=121 Not an Atom but the Celeron M is also a great CPU for this project. Its not the pretiest on the market but it ticks alot of the boxes. Its listed on the site as Price: $599 but as with all things Norco trying to find one in the EU is tricky. Need to track down what its branded as here. Link to comment
WeeboTech Posted June 5, 2009 Share Posted June 5, 2009 There was another link BubbaQ posted to an eBay link for the $400 range. I have this norco unit, it works, but you have to set a bios option to disable ACPI. During power down, it does not turn off the machine. Other then that it works fine. Uses 35-40 watts idle with drives spun down. There is room for a compact flash and a P-ATA laptop hard drive. Link to comment
c234rmf Posted June 6, 2009 Share Posted June 6, 2009 How about 4 SATA ports? This one has 4 do not know if its any good .... http://www.logicsupply.com/products/ms_9832 manual here http://www.msi.com/index.php?func=downloadfile&dno=8867&type=manual BTW it "ONLY" has 6 rs-232 ports - hope thats enough! Kind regards Link to comment
NAS Posted June 6, 2009 Author Share Posted June 6, 2009 When i said 5 it was an arbitrary number that sounded good. The main driver is that the per port cost of the NAS, which is found by adding up all the costs of the maximum density of the server and dividing out, is as low as possible. The next driver is space as i dont want to have 2 disk array for cabling and logistic purposes. But 4 could actually be fine depending on the case costs. This approach could be very interesting for alot of users as it will be very easy to source and build anywhere i the world using well known cheap bits. It will be quiet, fast enough and most of all dimensioned so that you dont hit all the problems massive array users face. The search continues for interesting components but this is really looking viable and at that point I will be asking Tom to release a version of unRAID costed to suit it.... essentially pro with a 4-5 disk limit. Link to comment
NAS Posted June 6, 2009 Author Share Posted June 6, 2009 Found via a link posted earlier.... http://www.tranquilpc-shop.co.uk/acatalog/BAREBONE_SERVERS.html#a15 looks intersting Link to comment
NAS Posted June 6, 2009 Author Share Posted June 6, 2009 This might be a nice 2U rack mount option (cheap) with standard PSU support: http://www.racksurf.co.uk/p/832670/x-case-rm-204-short---390mm-deep--.html Link to comment
cwr Posted June 6, 2009 Share Posted June 6, 2009 the PLUS version supports 6 drives and is $50 cheaper Link to comment
cwr Posted June 6, 2009 Share Posted June 6, 2009 i meant the PLUS version of the unraid license; http://www.lime-technology.com/joomla/products Link to comment
NAS Posted June 7, 2009 Author Share Posted June 7, 2009 I would be looking for all the features of a pro license short 15 disks Link to comment
bubbaQ Posted June 7, 2009 Share Posted June 7, 2009 Found via a link posted earlier.... http://www.tranquilpc-shop.co.uk/acatalog/BAREBONE_SERVERS.html#a15 looks intersting Review: http://www.wegotserved.com/2009/01/25/hands-on-tranquil-pc-bbs2-barebones-home-server/ This is exactly what I need for doing large acquisitions in the field. Link to comment
bubbaQ Posted June 7, 2009 Share Posted June 7, 2009 If you want ultra low power consumption, try this: http://green-pcs.co.uk/2009/06/04/latest-intel-mini-itx-main-board/ 12 Watts for the entire mobo. Even parity check w/ 5 drives will still be under 100W, so you can use an ultra-efficient 90W PSU. Link to comment
NAS Posted June 7, 2009 Author Share Posted June 7, 2009 I have been doing some more reading and this plan looks viable. I think were perhaps one generation (current coming generation) away from having the native on motherboard SATA density we want commonly available on multiple motherboards though (but that could be anytime now). What surprised me is the lack of good cases available at reasonable cost. The QNAP and the tranquil have nice cases but for the life of me I cant find someone supplying them alone. Theres no way they make them in house so somewhere in the world similar items exist for sale. Link to comment
Romir Posted June 8, 2009 Share Posted June 8, 2009 For bubbaQ: http://forums.vr-zone.com/hardware-arena/280489-another-itx-hehez-looks-interesting-65.html#post6806142 4 sata port Ion boards with 16x PCI-E slots are shipping from smaller oems who aren't afraid of Intel. (The POV/ION330 and IPX7A-ION.) This is also quite interesting, but not Atom related http://www.gigabyte.com.tw/Products/Networking/Products_Spec.aspx?ProductID=3054. Mini-itx AM2+ with 6 Sata and PCI-E x16. Link to comment
bubbaQ Posted June 8, 2009 Share Posted June 8, 2009 Seen the acrylic one before... but it doesn't take a std. mobo. But the BLACK one... that look good.... but I can't make out the model number.... looks like CFI-A7379, but that is obviously wrong. Link to comment
NAS Posted June 9, 2009 Author Share Posted June 9, 2009 One thing i have start looking at is cases rack and cube that dont have hot swap trays. In a 4-5 disk array trays are at this point an expensive luxury. Obviously if an option existed at the right price i would take them but i dont think its a basic requirement. A cube with 3*5.25" front slots could take one of these: Add on some filter elements and you could be done Link to comment
WeeboTech Posted June 9, 2009 Share Posted June 9, 2009 One thing i have start looking at is cases rack and cube that dont have hot swap trays. In a 4-5 disk array trays are at this point an expensive luxury. We're at the opposite ends of the spectrum here. I would not build a machine without removable drive trays. I've done it for so many years that it's a requirement in every system. I'm getting rid of any cases that do not support them (or enough density). It gets old taking apart a case to swap out drives. Link to comment
NAS Posted June 9, 2009 Author Share Posted June 9, 2009 Its just the price point. $200 bucks + for an empty case that support 5 drives adds $40 per drive to the actual cost. Thats alot... as much as the rest of the kit put together Link to comment
SSD Posted June 9, 2009 Share Posted June 9, 2009 One thing i have start looking at is cases rack and cube that dont have hot swap trays. In a 4-5 disk array trays are at this point an expensive luxury. We're at the opposite ends of the spectrum here. I would not build a machine without removable drive trays. I've done it for so many years that it's a requirement in every system. I'm getting rid of any cases that do not support them (or enough density). It gets old taking apart a case to swap out drives. I think this is very much a personal preference that has a lot to do with how much shuffling of disks a user tends to do. For my usage patterns, I agree with NAS (OMG, what am I saying ). When I do need to add or swap a disk (every 3-4 months or so), I take the opportunity to do preventative maintenance (like blowing out dust). Works for me. The trays are also not a perfect solution. they double the number of connections in the data and power paths (there have been a number of problems with drive connections isolated to the trays). Some trays have lousy cooling characteristics, and include small and noisy fans that cannot be (easily) upgraded. For me the convenience isn't worth the cost and these negatives. Link to comment
lionelhutz Posted June 9, 2009 Share Posted June 9, 2009 I'm sure I saw a custom build using this case with a 5 in 3 trayless adapter. The front was cut out and the power button had to move and then the modder used a piece of black plastic to make a new front face. http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811154091 Or live with a little bigger case like this and a 5 in 3 adapter? http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811190072 Peter Link to comment
NAS Posted June 9, 2009 Author Share Posted June 9, 2009 OMG bjp999 and I agree yikes My preferd solution is rack mount as i can pack them densly without using up to much space. Larger mini ATX + cases get unweidly once your looking at 5 or 10 of them Link to comment
lionelhutz Posted June 9, 2009 Share Posted June 9, 2009 This should work then; http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811219032 or this; http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811219023 Mini-ITX fits where mATX fits, right? It so, then an mini-ITX should also mount where a ATX fits?? Peter Link to comment
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