New to the community, looking at building a nice unRAID server

[DaringOne]

Hello all, ran across this great technology thanks to a MacWorld tweet the other day.  Impressed, and looking to build my own server to store all my media.  For this purpose, just grabbed myself a Linksys WRT310N Wireless Router with built in Gigabit switch to replace my old Linksys WRT54G.  Looking to pair an unRAID server with a yet-to-be purchased Mac Mini + Plex.  My tech expertise is above average, but I've been out of the game since building my P4 1.5Ghz with 512MB RDRAM, (DDR was not yet available on Intel) so that should give you an idea of how long it's been  

 

Anyhow, here's what I've pieced together from Newegg for a man on a pretty tight budget, with Newegg part numbers in parenthesis:

 

CoolerMaster Centurion 5 ATX Mid Tower Case (N82E16811119068) - $49.99

Intel BOXDP43TF LGA 775 Intel P43 ATX Intel Motherboard (6 SATA Ports) (N82E16813121351) - $84.99

Rosewill Green Series RG700-S12 700W Continuous @40°C,80 PLUS Certified,Single 12V Rail... etc (N82E16817182191) - $69.99

Intel Pentium E5300 Wolfdale 2.6GHz LGA 775 65W Dual-Core - Retail (N82E16819116074) - $67.99

G.SKILL 2GB (2 x 1GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 800 (PC2 6400) Dual Channel Kit (N82E16820231098) - $49.99

2 Western Digital Caviar Black WD1001FALS 1TB 7200 RPM SATA 3.0Gb/s Drives (N82E16822136284) - $199.98

 

Total Cost - $522.93

 

So, a few things here.  I know that this machine doesn't need a truckload of horsepower, and the more space available for drives, the better.  So that was behind the choice for the case since it had ample room (five 3.5" bays and five 5.25 inch bays that could be adapted) and was very affordable.  I went with the cheapest apparently reliable motherboard (4 eggs on Newegg) that had at least 6 SATA slots on it.  I'm open to suggestions on boards, as that was the largest cost of the machine.  I'm mildly open to processor suggestions, just keep in mind that I've always been an Intel man, so AMD need not apply.  Dunno if a Celeron would get the job done here, which would reduce the processor cost significantly as well.

 

On a separate note, anyone currently using Plex with MacOS to be a media server, I'll take all the user testimonials I can get.  I'm still flip-flopping on what to use for the media playback.  I already own PlayOn, and have a PS3 that can take advantage of it.  However, I would actually prefer Plex, as it's a much slicker interface and the Mac Mini blends VERY nicely with my existing home theater setup.

 

All input is appreciated.  Thanks!

[reggie14]

The motherboard uses the Intel 82567V network chipset.  That isn't listed on the Hardware Compatibility page though.  However, I think there's a decent chance it will work.  From what I understand, the Intel 82567LM network chipset didn't work until unRAID 4.5.  So, you'd be a guinea pig with that motherboard if you get it.

 

Do you have a video card to put in your server?  Even if you're going to use it headless I still think you'll need a video card to get the thing to boot. I think that's more dependent on the BIOS than it is the operating system.

[Rajahal]

AMD man here, so take what I say with a grain of salt

 

Do you plan on running unRAID stock or with add-ons?  If stock, then go for the cheapest, slowest processor you can find, such as this one: Intel Celeron 430 Conroe-L 1.8GHz 512KB L2 Cache LGA 775 35W Single-Core Processor (I know unRAID suggests a minimum of 2.0 GHz CPU speed, but I've run it on a 1.6 GHz before and noticed no performance differences)

 

If you plan on using add-ons, then a faster dual core processor like the one you linked may be more appropriate, but is still not required.

 

How many drives do you plan on supporting in the long run?  A 700 W PSU seems like overkill to me (I'm running 8 drives on a 380 W PSU), but that really depends on your plans for future upgradabiliy.

 

How important is write speed to you?  If all you care about is being able to stream HD video to your media player, then there's no need to pay extra for WD Black drives...go for the Greens.  They will save you money on the initial purchase, and in the long run (due to lower power consumption).

 

I would also recommend going for 1.5 or 2 TB drives to get a better bang-for-your-buck.  WD 1.5 TB Greens are currently only $110.

 

I agree with reggie14 that you should look for a mobo with onboard video, so that you don't have to buy a separate video card.  This combo might interest you (though I find the RAM prohibitively expensive).

 

Finally, for a cheaper and better media player solution than Plex/MacMini, check out XBMC/Revo.

[DaringOne]

I guess that's going to depend on what the addons can do for me.  I haven't explored this yet.  As for the motherboard, I've decided I'm sticking with the board I mentioned and taking my chances with the onboard NIC.  If all else fails, I can install an add-on board if this fails. As for the WD Greens, I'd read elsewhere I think on these boards, that there's something up with the drives parking causing issues with RAID applications with these drives.   I'll have to check up on the XBMC, though if I understand right, this is what Plex is based on.  I need something dirt simple, since my wife needs to be able to run this.  If it's anything less simple than switch to the video source and click play, it's too complex.

[purko]

As for the WD Greens, I'd read elsewhere I think on these boards, that there's something up with the drives parking causing issues with RAID applications with these drives.

 

WD Greens work perfectly well with unRAID.

 

You must have read that some place else.

And if so, that has nothing to do with unRAID.

 

 

[reggie14]

As for the motherboard, I've decided I'm sticking with the board I mentioned and taking my chances with the onboard NIC.

 

It seems like the Intel BOXDG43NB is pretty similar, except that it has onboard video.  The only problem I see with this board is that, if you trust the newegg reviewers, the PCIe x16 slot doesn't work with SATA controllers.  It does, however, have 3 PCIe x1 slots, and its probably cheaper to buy two or three boards with 2 SATA ports, than it is to buy one board with 4 ports.

[WeeboTech]

As for the motherboard, I've decided I'm sticking with the board I mentioned and taking my chances with the onboard NIC.

 

It seems like the Intel BOXDG43NB is pretty similar, except that it has onboard video.  The only problem I see with this board is that, if you trust the newegg reviewers, the PCIe x16 slot doesn't work with SATA controllers.  It does, however, have 3 PCIe x1 slots, and its probably cheaper to buy two or three boards with 2 SATA ports, than it is to buy one board with 4 ports.

 

1 2port board can be had for around $20-$24. a 4 Port board can be had for around $50-$60/

So it's not that wide of a gap.

 

 

Look into the Supermicro Atom based boards.

http://www.supermicro.com/products/motherboard/ATOM/945/X7SLA.cfm?typ=H

 

1. Intel® Atom™ 330 Dual-Core 1.6GHz

    (FSB 533 MHz)

2. Intel® 945GC Chipset

3. Up to 2GB dual channel unbuffered,

    non-ECC DDR2 667*/533/400 SDRAM

4. 2x Realtek RTL8111C-GR Gigabit

    LAN

5. 4x SATA (3.0Gbps) Ports

    RAID 0, 1, 5, 10 (Windows Only)

6. 1 (x8) PCI-E, 1 (x4) PCI-E (in x8)

    1x 32-bit 33MHz PCI slot

7. Onboard GMA950 Video

8. 2 rear USB ports + 3 headers (5 ports)

    + 1 Type A connector

 

Go with a Cooler master CM590. With this board and that case you can grow to 9/10 drives easily.

 

GO with the WD Green drives, you'll be fine. as your system gets busier andbusier you can change out the parity drive to a higer end model.

[Kaygee]

WD green drives are not suitable for RAID installs, their error retry management takes too long (>7 secs) for most hardware RAID controllers, this causes the drives to be dropped from the array.

 

Unraid is not a hardware raid solution so doesnt have this issue (its not just WD green drives but any WD desktop drive and I'm sure several other manufacturers as well).

 

WD state their desktop drives are unsuitable for RAID, streaming or 24/7 operation.

 

 

[Rajahal]

I'll have to check up on the XBMC, though if I understand right, this is what Plex is based on.  I need something dirt simple, since my wife needs to be able to run this.  If it's anything less simple than switch to the video source and click play, it's too complex.

 

That's correct, Plex is XBMC ported to the Mac.  XBMC is for Windows and Linux only.  If you've used Plex and like it, then you should also like XBMC.  It is dirt simple, I haven't found anything simpler, and I've been building HTPCs for longer than I've had my unRAID server

[DaringOne]

Alrighty!  So I've taken some of your suggestions, did some reading on the forums and recommended hardware page and reconfig'd 

 

Here's what I'm lined up with now.  It's a bit more expensive, but I'm shooting for reliability rather than experimentation, so I'll pay the premium for that.

 

CoolerMaster Centurion 5 ATX Mid Tower Case (N82E16811119068) - $49.99

Supermicro MBD-C2SEE-O LGA 775 Intel G43 ATX Intel Motherboard (6 SATA Ports) Current Ebay Price (Newegg unavailable)- $117.48

CORSAIR CMPSU-650TX 650W ATX12V... etc (N82E16817139005) - $99.99

Intel Pentium E5300 Wolfdale 2.6GHz LGA 775 65W Dual-Core - Retail (N82E16819116074) - $67.99

G.SKILL 2GB (2 x 1GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1333 (PC3 10600) Dual Channel Kit (N82E16820231134) - $64.99

2 Western Digital Caviar Green WD10000CSRTL 1TB 7200 RPM 16MB Cache SATA 3.0Gb/s 3.5" Drives (N82E16822136236) - $189.98

 

Total Cost - $590.42

 

I could probably save the coin on the case, as I have a mid-ATX case already, but I'm not entirely sure about the airflow through it, and if I could successfully convert the 4 5-1/4 bays to 3-1/2 bays.  It currently has 2 80mm fans in it (1 intake and one output), and the airflow seems nice, though I need to plug some holes where I removed cards and discarded the bay covers who-knows-where.

 

I'd considered dropping to the Celeron E3300, but the mobo appears to require DDR3/800 at the lowest, which I cannot find anywhere on Newegg, and the hardware guide recommended matching the memory speed to the cpu FSB speed.  Plus, the savings was only $30 overall, so it was another cost/convenience decision.

 

As before, I'm begging for input.  I may not get to build this for a bit (2-3 months) but I want to have a clear picture in my mind when I make the purchase.  Thanks for everyone's understanding and help with the newb!

[jdmlight]

On a separate note, anyone currently using Plex with MacOS to be a media server, I'll take all the user testimonials I can get.  I'm still flip-flopping on what to use for the media playback.  I already own PlayOn, and have a PS3 that can take advantage of it.  However, I would actually prefer Plex, as it's a much slicker interface and the Mac Mini blends VERY nicely with my existing home theater setup.

I'm currently using a Mac Mini with Plex and unRAID.  It's great.  The interface is really slick and 1080p playback is smooth as butter.  You could do XBMC and get the MediaStream skin.  But seeing as you're a Mac guy, you'd probably be happier with the Mac Mini.  I am.  My current unRAID server was my media center for a while, but after a while I got fed up with Windows - so it got repurposed .  A Mac Mini is a great form factor to sit by a nice big flatscreen TV.  Oh and the Mac Mini has higher WAF.

[Rajahal]

You might consider the Cooler Master CM 590 instead of the Centurion 5 you listed.  It is $20 more expensive, but it will give you far better expandability options for the future.  The CM 590 is by far the most popular case on these forums, so much so that LimeTech started building their latest model, the RB-1200, out of it.

 

All your other components look good to me.

 

As for your HTPC, I still stand by the XBMC/Revo option.  The Revo is far cheaper and just as capable.

[gabbott]

 

That's correct, Plex is XBMC ported to the Mac.  XBMC is for Windows and Linux only. 

 

Off-topic but just wanted to mention that Plex is a mac-version only fork of xbmc, it is not XBMC only based off of it. There is a native xbmc version that runs on the mac. XBMC runs on Linux, Windows, and the mac.

[pfp]

Supermicro MBD-C2SEE-O LGA 775 Intel G43 ATX Intel Motherboard (6 SATA Ports) Current Ebay Price (Newegg unavailable)- $117.48

 

If you would rather buy from a real store and not Ebay you can also use the Supermicro C2SEA board which is generally available.  The Wiki doesn't show it as 100% compatable but it's pretty much the same as the C2SEE and it looks like Lime-Tech is using this board in their own builds now too.

 

Scroll down to the bottom and you will notice all three models use the C2SEA

http://lime-technology.com/products/md-1510-server

 

[DaringOne]

 

If you would rather buy from a real store and not Ebay you can also use the Supermicro C2SEA board which is generally available.  The Wiki doesn't show it as 100% compatable but it's pretty much the same as the C2SEE and it looks like Lime-Tech is using this board in their own builds now too.

 

Scroll down to the bottom and you will notice all three models use the C2SEA

http://lime-technology.com/products/md-1510-server

 

 

Very much so!  Thanks for the tip there.  I've added it to my Newegg wishlist.

[DaringOne]

You might consider the Cooler Master CM 590 instead of the Centurion 5 you listed.  It is $20 more expensive, but it will give you far better expandability options for the future.  The CM 590 is by far the most popular case on these forums, so much so that LimeTech started building their latest model, the RB-1200, out of it.

 

All your other components look good to me.

 

As for your HTPC, I still stand by the XBMC/Revo option.  The Revo is far cheaper and just as capable.

 

Thanks for the link to the CM 590.  I'd seen it mentioned, but hadn't checked it out yet.  I agree, the $20 premium appears to be worth it.  Just look at all those fan bays!  It's been slotted into my build in place of the Centurion 5.  I might give XBMC/Revo a shot just to see what I'm going to get while using Plex.  Thing is, it goes back to the "dirt simple" thing.  If my wife has to use a mouse and a keyboard, the solution is sunk.  With a Mac Mini, I can buy an Apple Remote and she'll be content.  If it was just me, I could care less what computer sits next to my entertainment center, how loud it is (as long as it's not obnoxious) or what hoops I have to jump though to use it.  Problem is that she likes things to look nice and is *somewhat* of a technophobe, so I have to make this thing work as close to a DVR as I can.

[smino]

Alrighty!  So I've taken some of your suggestions, did some reading on the forums and recommended hardware page and reconfig'd 

 

Here's what I'm lined up with now.  It's a bit more expensive, but I'm shooting for reliability rather than experimentation, so I'll pay the premium for that.

 

CoolerMaster Centurion 5 ATX Mid Tower Case (N82E16811119068) - $49.99

Supermicro MBD-C2SEE-O LGA 775 Intel G43 ATX Intel Motherboard (6 SATA Ports) Current Ebay Price (Newegg unavailable)- $117.48

CORSAIR CMPSU-650TX 650W ATX12V... etc (N82E16817139005) - $99.99

Intel Pentium E5300 Wolfdale 2.6GHz LGA 775 65W Dual-Core - Retail (N82E16819116074) - $67.99

G.SKILL 2GB (2 x 1GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1333 (PC3 10600) Dual Channel Kit (N82E16820231134) - $64.99

2 Western Digital Caviar Green WD10000CSRTL 1TB 7200 RPM 16MB Cache SATA 3.0Gb/s 3.5" Drives (N82E16822136236) - $189.98

 

Total Cost - $590.42

 

I could probably save the coin on the case, as I have a mid-ATX case already, but I'm not entirely sure about the airflow through it, and if I could successfully convert the 4 5-1/4 bays to 3-1/2 bays.  It currently has 2 80mm fans in it (1 intake and one output), and the airflow seems nice, though I need to plug some holes where I removed cards and discarded the bay covers who-knows-where.

 

I'd considered dropping to the Celeron E3300, but the mobo appears to require DDR3/800 at the lowest, which I cannot find anywhere on Newegg, and the hardware guide recommended matching the memory speed to the cpu FSB speed.  Plus, the savings was only $30 overall, so it was another cost/convenience decision.

 

As before, I'm begging for input.  I may not get to build this for a bit (2-3 months) but I want to have a clear picture in my mind when I make the purchase.  Thanks for everyone's understanding and help with the newb!

 

Have you tried LinuxMCE?

[DaringOne]

Can't say that I have, or know what it is 

[jdmlight]

You might consider the Cooler Master CM 590 instead of the Centurion 5 you listed.  It is $20 more expensive, but it will give you far better expandability options for the future.  The CM 590 is by far the most popular case on these forums, so much so that LimeTech started building their latest model, the RB-1200, out of it.

 

All your other components look good to me.

 

As for your HTPC, I still stand by the XBMC/Revo option.  The Revo is far cheaper and just as capable.

 

Thanks for the link to the CM 590.  I'd seen it mentioned, but hadn't checked it out yet.  I agree, the $20 premium appears to be worth it.  Just look at all those fan bays!  It's been slotted into my build in place of the Centurion 5.  I might give XBMC/Revo a shot just to see what I'm going to get while using Plex.  Thing is, it goes back to the "dirt simple" thing.  If my wife has to use a mouse and a keyboard, the solution is sunk.  With a Mac Mini, I can buy an Apple Remote and she'll be content.  If it was just me, I could care less what computer sits next to my entertainment center, how loud it is (as long as it's not obnoxious) or what hoops I have to jump though to use it.  Problem is that she likes things to look nice and is *somewhat* of a technophobe, so I have to make this thing work as close to a DVR as I can.

Since you're mentioning the remote...

 

Something really nice about the Mac Mini + Plex setup is that you can either use the little Apple remote OR get a Logitech Harmony remote and use that.  Plex works some voodoo magic to be able to use the built-in infrared port and get all of the buttons on the Harmony remote.  Basically the advantage is more buttons over the Apple remote (dedicated buttons for fast forward, rewind, play, pause, directional controls, numbers, etc).

[DaringOne]

And it's begun!  I did some more digging, and determined that since I don't plan on having more than 6 drives in this machine, a Corsair 400W PSU would do just fine.  Newegg so happened to have said PSU available for $54.99, with free shipping, and a $15 MIR.  $39.99 for a good PSU?  Couldn't pass it up.  I'm off and running!  My new specs:

 

COOLER MASTER Centurion 590 RC-590-KKN1-GP Black SECC (N82E16811119152) - $69.99

SUPERMICRO MBD-C2SEA-O LGA 775 Intel G45 HDMI ATX Intel Motherboard (6 SATA Ports) (N82E16813182161)- $124.99

CORSAIR CMPSU-400CX 400W ATX12V V2.2 80 PLUS... etc (N82E16817139008) - $39.99 After MIR Purchased

Intel Pentium E5300 Wolfdale 2.6GHz LGA 775 65W Dual-Core - Retail (N82E16819116074) - $67.99

G.SKILL 2GB (2 x 1GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1333 (PC3 10600) Dual Channel Kit (N82E16820231134) - $64.99

2 Western Digital Caviar Green WD10000CSRTL 1TB 7200 RPM 16MB Cache SATA 3.0Gb/s 3.5" Drives (N82E16822136236) - $189.98

 

Total Cost - $557.93

Total Spent - $39.99

Remaining - $517.94

Shipping Costs - $0.00

[DaringOne]

Since you're mentioning the remote...

 

Something really nice about the Mac Mini + Plex setup is that you can either use the little Apple remote OR get a Logitech Harmony remote and use that.  Plex works some voodoo magic to be able to use the built-in infrared port and get all of the buttons on the Harmony remote.  Basically the advantage is more buttons over the Apple remote (dedicated buttons for fast forward, rewind, play, pause, directional controls, numbers, etc).

 

Which version of the Harmony would be compatible?  There are a lot of them, and some are a third of the cost of this machine!

[jdmlight]

Since you're mentioning the remote...

 

Something really nice about the Mac Mini + Plex setup is that you can either use the little Apple remote OR get a Logitech Harmony remote and use that.  Plex works some voodoo magic to be able to use the built-in infrared port and get all of the buttons on the Harmony remote.  Basically the advantage is more buttons over the Apple remote (dedicated buttons for fast forward, rewind, play, pause, directional controls, numbers, etc).

 

Which version of the Harmony would be compatible?  There are a lot of them, and some are a third of the cost of this machine!

Any of them should be compatible.  I got a fantastic deal on a Harmony 880, so that's what I use.  My dad uses a Harmony One.

 

The difference between the models is the number of devices they can control, color vs. black-and-white screen, some have a touchscreen, and rechargeable vs. alkalines.  A few have RF (you don't need line-of-sight, and you can use the remote a few rooms away) in addition to infrared - these typically cost quite a bit though.

 

If you don't have more than 5 devices to control and don't mind using regular alkaline batteries, I'd recommend the Harmony 510.  It's on sale at NewEgg right now for $68 after promo code (with free shipping).  It's recertified, but I have had no troubles with my recertified Harmony 880.

 

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16880111031&Tpk=harmony%20510

 

If you're looking for the ultimate in ease-of-use, you should strongly consider a Harmony.  The setup application could be improved, but if you're tech savvy you can figure it out (and it's something your wife would never have to see, it's just for setting up devices and how you want stuff controlled).  Once it's set up, it's as easy to use as pushing "Watch Movies" - it turns on your TV, receiver, Mini, etc. and sets them all to the appropriate inputs.  If something goes wrong there's even a help button (that really does work for most things).

 

If you can't tell I love my Harmony remote.

[Rajahal]

I personally have never used a Harmony, but I've heard great things about them, so I would echo the recommendation.

 

I use a simple MCE remote with my XBMC/Revo HTPC, but it is somewhat limited, so I've been thinking about getting a Harmony as well.  The only disadvantage of this set up is that the remote requires an external USB receiver.  Depending on how you look at it, this could also be an advantage because it would allow you to hide the HTPC away in a cabinet and have only the small receiver visible.

 

No mouse or keyboard is required for day-to-day use of the XBMC/Revo, though at least a keyboard is required for the initial installation.

 

The only advantages of the Mac Mini over the Revo that I can think of are:

1) built-in IR receiver (which could be a disadvantage too, see above)

2) built-in DVD drive (I never watch optical media anymore, so this doesn't effect me)

 

Are those two extras worth the $400 difference?  Not to me.

[DaringOne]

Well, I do have one other motivation for the Mac Mini... Wife and I are expecting in May, and from what I've seen of iMovie (or is it iDVD now?  I can't remember) it's pretty much the simplest movie editor ever.  I'd like an easy way to store and edit home movies for our use, but that won't be the main function of the box for sure.  I realize that this too, probably isn't worth the premium, but I'm an Apple honk, so what can I say? 

[Rajahal]

I agree that iMovie is a fantastic bit of software.  Video editing isn't normally a function of an HTPC, but if you are looking for a Desktop PC that doubles as an HTPC, then the Mac Mini is probably a better option for you.

 

Congrats on the imminent offspring!