johnodon Posted February 9, 2011 Share Posted February 9, 2011 I have only recently stumbled across unRAID. You can thank the XBMC forums for that! Anyway, the idea really intrigued me..especially being able to mix and match drives. And then I had an epiphany. I remembered reading an article some time ago that showed a server case in which the drives were mounted vertically. I thought “wow…this would be a perfect solution for an unRAID box…ease of access to add/upgrade drives.”. I racked my brain and finally remembered that the article had something to do with “cheap petabyte”. So I Googled just that and found the article: “Petabyte on a Budget: How to Build Cheap Cloud Storage”. Here it is: http://blog.backblaze.com/2009/09/01/petabytes-on-a-budget-how-to-build-cheap-cloud-storage/ One thing that I wanted to accomplish was to keep the price down. I thought the easiest way to do this was to forgo the backplanes and flip the drives so the connections are face up. This way when I need to add/upgrade a drive, all I have to do is shut her down, slide the top of the case open, hook up the drive, close her up and power on/configure. This would also allow me to avoid the cost of drive trays and such. So, I am off and running. The first thing I needed to find was an affordable 4U chassis that would accommodate my needs (namely the ability to remove all of the forward drive cages). The one I settled on was the D-416 4U Compact Stylish Rackmount Chassis. I got this from Newegg for $102.99. As you can see in the pics below, all of the drive cages are merely screwed in (no rivets): My plan is to construct my own skeletal drive cage out of angle aluminum. The inspiration for this came from this thread: http://www.overclockers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=475428 Picture a shoebox that is open on all sides with dividers running from front to back (north to south) every 1” and a center divider running the length down the middle from east to west two make for two rows of drives. Now double that for top and bottom for stability and foam rubber on the bottom for some shock absorption. The entire cage will be bolted to the bottom of the chassis. Here is a rough top/down view: I just received the case today and started taking some measurements. If done right, I can comfortably fit 20 drives and still have 3 empty slots in the middle. Each set of 10 drives on the right and left will have a 120mm fan attached to the front of the cage. There will be about a ¼” gap between each drive for airflow. A 80mm fan will cool the 3 additional drives. This is VERY MUCH a work in progress. When I get home from work today, I am going to start construction on the cage. One thing is certain…things will be VERY tight. I hope my math skills do not fail me! ? I will keep this post updated with progress. John Quote Link to comment
aiden Posted February 9, 2011 Share Posted February 9, 2011 That BackBlaze article circulated around here for quite a while when it first came out. Their solution is very simple and inexpensive relative to the density, and has a lot of really sweet features. I'm envious you found a case you can manipulate so much, so I look forward to your progress. Please update with your exact measurements, and you might want to reach out to some of the other case modders on here, most notably Queeg and Raj. Quote Link to comment
kizer Posted February 9, 2011 Share Posted February 9, 2011 What are they plugging their drives into? I've been kicking around a design in my head for a case, but I'd like to know what they are using to dock their drives into. Obviously it has to have a power and a sata plug for the drive to just simply plug into. Any locations anybody can think of. http://www2.corsair.com/_images/systembuild/1099104/8095%20Attach%20SATA%20Backplane%20Power.jpg[/img] Quote Link to comment
aiden Posted February 9, 2011 Share Posted February 9, 2011 According to the article, they are (were) using Chyang Fun Industry (CFI Group) CFI-B53PM 5 Port Backplanes on the bottom of the server, and keeping the drives seated with gravity. Someone did research a price on these when the article first came out, and CFI was very responsive to the inquiries and offered bulk discounting. Here is their signal path diagram: Quote Link to comment
Joe L. Posted February 9, 2011 Share Posted February 9, 2011 I made a similar rack out of aluminum angle stock, but in a very inexpensive 5U chassis I purchased from geeks.com for $27.99 shipping included. You can see the drives are mounted from the front, with all the cabling from the top. http://lime-technology.com/forum/index.php?topic=2031.msg67670#msg67670 I only put one row of disks, 14 across, with about 1/8th inch between each for airflow, but I do have room for a second row if I care to get crazy. I have the three 120mm fans on low speed. The disks were really cool with them at high speed, but the noise was way louder. At low speed the disks sit at 19C when idle and get up the mid to upper 20s when all active. Quote Link to comment
lionelhutz Posted February 9, 2011 Share Posted February 9, 2011 The Backblaze server uses port multipliers and they are putting 15 drives on a PCI card. Not really the highest speed here. It would be very interesting to find a similar type of card with individual ports broken out, similar to other backplane cards. however, it would need edge connectors for the SATA and power input connectors. I still doubt you can do ~20 drives in hotswap cheaper than you could just buy a Norco case. Peter Quote Link to comment
kizer Posted February 9, 2011 Share Posted February 9, 2011 Did some looking around for the cards. http://www.sierra-cables.com/Adapters/SATA.aspx http://www.oocities.com/scsiway/sataesata.htm http://www.sportslinkup.com/shop/0-Sata-backplane-1-LOWEST.html http://www.aliexpress.com/product-fm/317482757-SAS-HDD-TO-SATA-SAS-Serial-Attached-SCSI-Hot-Swap-Backplane-Adapter-wholesalers.html http://www.aliexpress.com/product-gs/378981752-SAS-TO-TWO-SATA-ADAPTER-wholesalers.html Quote Link to comment
lionelhutz Posted February 9, 2011 Share Posted February 9, 2011 Those IBM backplane brackets at $4.50 each might be usable for a cheaper case. Especially when you consider they include the cables so no need for SATA cables as well as the brackets. The seller might only have 1 available though. Anything that costs upwards of $10 each will put you around $200 just for enough connectors to build a 20 drive case and you still need to build the rest of the case. One of those links leads here - http://stores.ebay.com/Good-Deals-4-Smart-U Could be a cheap source for hot-swap cages. Peter Quote Link to comment
opentoe Posted February 10, 2011 Share Posted February 10, 2011 I see the drives plug into the board itself, but what connects to the board? Wires? Cables? How is it all powered? Quote Link to comment
kizer Posted February 10, 2011 Share Posted February 10, 2011 If you look at the picture I posted up above a few replies ago you will see the backside of the card. The drive is on the other side. On the backside the Sata and power connectors plug in and on the drive side is the male end that plugs into the back of the drive. However without positive pressure I would worry that the drive would loose connection, but I'm sure with the drives weight it would help. I only brought up questioning the source of these connections because I've had a case design in my head for the longest time and if I wanted to I could move ahead as long as well prices didn't drive it sky high. Drobos, Buffalo's, Dlink DNS-323 all use this type of connection like the HotSwap Bays. Quote Link to comment
sacretagent Posted February 10, 2011 Share Posted February 10, 2011 thanks for the links Kizer i am in the process of looking into making my own hotswap drives cages (5 in 3) and if i can get somebody to make me the cages in aluminium then i will add the IBM backplanes in them ... normally should get an answer today if the guy can make the cages and how much they would cost spend last sunday all afternoon in Pantip Plaza to find 5 in 3 cages and the only ones i found where the icy docks but at 6350 bath a piece divide that by 32 for US$ and you have 198 US$ http://www.pcgallery.co.th/pcg/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=270&Itemid=136 if this wouldn't work then i think i will need somebodies help to ship them to me or go for a Norco alike which will set me back 19000 bath http://compware-agency.com/4u/100-rackmount-server-4u-d23-no-power-supply.html but i would hate to bring a noisy machine into my living room Quote Link to comment
Rajahal Posted February 10, 2011 Share Posted February 10, 2011 Great project, I definitely look forward to the results. I wonder if someone could make their own ghetto 'backplanes' by strapping together a few of these SATA power/data combo cables: I expect the main issue would be getting them to be sturdy enough as a unit to support hot swapping a drive. Quote Link to comment
kizer Posted February 10, 2011 Share Posted February 10, 2011 Wow I see some particle board and hot glue in my future. LOL I didn't realize you could get a combo that cheap. Quote Link to comment
sacretagent Posted February 10, 2011 Share Posted February 10, 2011 Wow I see some particle board and hot glue in my future. LOL I didn't realize you could get a combo that cheap. we want pictures of hot glued fingers ... euuuh.. sata/power cable combo on particle board Quote Link to comment
Rajahal Posted February 10, 2011 Share Posted February 10, 2011 I'm pretty sure they are actually cheaper at monoprice, but they seem to be out of stock at the moment...and the lack of picture makes it hard to tell if it is the right cable or not. http://www.monoprice.com/products/product.asp?c_id=102&cp_id=10226&cs_id=1022605&p_id=7639&seq=1&format=2 Quote Link to comment
lionelhutz Posted February 10, 2011 Share Posted February 10, 2011 Combine those combo connectors with a CAD program and a cheap case could be made. I actually know a company close to me with a router table and another place a few hours away with a water jet. Both are be suitable for cutting plastics with good precision. One piece to hold the connectors and 2 more with drive cutouts could make a usable rack. If you were really tricky then you'd cut one piece of plastic to surround that connector and another piece with smaller holes to support the back of it. I'm still not sure how easily the drive would plug and unplug from that connector if it was solidly mounted. Peter Quote Link to comment
johnodon Posted February 10, 2011 Author Share Posted February 10, 2011 Combine those combo connectors with a CAD program and a cheap case could be made. I actually know a company close to me with a router table and another place a few hours away with a water jet. Both are be suitable for cutting plastics with good precision. One piece to hold the connectors and 21 more with drive cutouts could make a usable rack. If you were really tricky then you'd cut one piece of plastic to surround that connector and another piece with smaller holes to support the back of it. I'm still not sure how easily the drive would plug and unplug from that connector if it was solidly mounted. Peter That is why I am going to do it the Irish way and flip the drives upright and just plug cables in. John Quote Link to comment
kizer Posted February 10, 2011 Share Posted February 10, 2011 LOL, you take all the fun out of it. Quote Link to comment
johnodon Posted February 10, 2011 Author Share Posted February 10, 2011 LOL, you take all the fun out of it. Nah...I'm just that poor! Now I know what my buddy meant when he alwasy called kids "energy and money vampires". Quote Link to comment
bcbgboy13 Posted February 10, 2011 Share Posted February 10, 2011 Add this relatively "cheap" controller for 24 hard drives - it is open box so you pay significantly less than the full price: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16816151064R Quote Link to comment
johnodon Posted February 11, 2011 Author Share Posted February 11, 2011 OK...I think I came up with a good model for the drive rack. It will be made out of aluminum rails and round bar attached to brackets I plan to fashion and attach to the inside walls of the case. Unfortunately, since I plan on using round bar I won't be able to attach those the rails using screws. My plan was to use some kind of industrial adhesive (just a drop) on each end and in the middle (middle rail to separate the 2 rows of drives). I was just going to use Gorilla Glue...does anyone have a better suggestion that may be made specifically for aluminum? Also, motherboard, power supply, sata cards and 2x 2tb drives showed up yesterday. At some point I will list all of my HW and costs. I already had most of the drives, teh CPU and memory. I have such little room in the front of the case to cool the drives, I had to order 2 of these slim fans: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835185139&Tpk=N82E16835185139 I'll post some pics later with the case gutted and the MB and PSU mounted. Although I know most want to see the drive rack completed. I was hoping to do that this weekend, but it is my son's 1st b-day. I think the wife may have other plans. TIA, John Quote Link to comment
Joe L. Posted February 11, 2011 Share Posted February 11, 2011 Unfortunately, since I plan on using round bar I won't be able to attach those the rails using screws. My plan was to use some kind of industrial adhesive (just a drop) on each end and in the middle (middle rail to separate the 2 rows of drives). I was just going to use Gorilla Glue...does anyone have a better suggestion that may be made specifically for aluminum? I used alumium brazing rod to braze the end brackets when I made my custom "rack" It was similar to this: http://www.harborfreight.com/pack-of-8-alumiweld-aluminum-welding-rods-44810.html I used it to fashion the brackets on the ends of my rails, but your idea of using round-stock to separate the drives looks like a good one. I might borrow it for the internal rack when I go to expand mine. I used a propane torch to perform the brazing of the aluminum. Worked perfectly and the braze is stronger than the aluminum angle. Joe L. Quote Link to comment
johnodon Posted February 11, 2011 Author Share Posted February 11, 2011 That is a good idea Joe. I have done that with stainless for my beer making equipment. I know that SS required a special flux and I thought aluminum was the same. Can you confirm? I really would like to do something better than adhesive. Thanks, John Quote Link to comment
Joe L. Posted February 11, 2011 Share Posted February 11, 2011 That is a good idea Joe. I have done that with stainless for my beer making equipment. I know that SS required a special flux and I thought aluminum was the same. Can you confirm? I really would like to do something better than adhesive. Thanks, John No flux needed at all. You do need to use a stainless steel brush to clean the aluminum first... (they specifically say to NOT use a brass brush) The package of rods I purchased came with the brush. The rods melt at a relatively low temperature, so a standard propane torch is enough. It is much like sweat soldering copper pipe. Quote Link to comment
johnodon Posted February 11, 2011 Author Share Posted February 11, 2011 No flux needed at all. You do need to use a stainless steel brush to clean the aluminum first... (they specifically say to NOT use a brass brush) The package of rods I purchased came with the brush. The rods melt at a relatively low temperature, so a standard propane torch is enough. It is much like sweat soldering copper pipe. Did they sell those rods in-store or did you have to order them? John Quote Link to comment
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