Unraid 6.12.6 spin down usb drive not working

[Peter05]

Hello, I'm new to Unraid and testing if it fit my needs.

I'm want a solution consuming low energy by using a thin client and usb-drives.

(And I know this is not recommended and RAM better have ECC for server solutions...)

 

Currently one M.2 as cache installed and one USB-Drive attached. Running 2 docker container.

 

Spin down of the USD-Drive seems not working. Ether the spin down delay nor 'click' spin down in main menue set the drive spind down. The M.2 drive does message spin down for a short time - until SMART wakes it up.

Did I missed some configuration?

Are there still fiels on the Array that should be part ov the cache?
Or is this depending on the USB-Drive and can't be triggered by Unraid?
 

Thanks a lot

neuland-diagnostics-20231223-1253.zip

[itimpi]

10 minutes ago, Peter05 said:

time - until SMART wakes it up.

It is not SMART that wakes it up - the syslog shows Unraid attempting to read SMART information AFTER a dtive that was previously spun down has spun back up again (typically because a read or write access was made.

[trurl]

56 minutes ago, Peter05 said:

I know this is not recommended

Since you are running without parity maybe you will avoid some of the problems with USB since there is nothing for the array to be in sync with.

[JorgeB]

Some USB bridges have issues with spin down, just recently a user had a couple of similar USB drives from the same brand, one stayed spun down, the other didn't.

[Peter05]

Thanks for your reply.

I have no additional drive for testing a setup - so I ended up with on USB Drive and one M.2 drive.

 

Quote

It is not SMART that wakes it up - the syslog shows Unraid attempting to read SMART information AFTER a dtive that was previously spun down has spun back up again (typically because a read or write access was made.

Is this a part of false configuration?

I though I moved all relevant parts to the cache.

Will this also be a problem if there is an array with parity? If I buy additional drives?

Thank you 

 

 

 

 

 

[JorgeB]

It can be a problem with USB drives, usually spin down works properly with SATA drives.

[trurl]

On 12/24/2023 at 7:49 AM, Peter05 said:

problem if there is an array with parity?

If you have USB disks in an array with parity, any disconnects are likely to make the array out-of-sync, requiring rebuild.

[Pterodactylus]

Hi together,

 

same problem with USB HDD (WD Elements 1 TB) here. I'm currently running Plex on a RP4 under OMV6 and think about upgrading. I bought a used Dell Wyse 5070 where i can use external HDDs only. The WD Elements spins down perfectly if connected to the RP4, and it looks like this also works on Unraid 6.12.6, but only a single time. The system log tells me that the disk is spun down, but in the next line i get:

Quote

emhttpd: spinning down /dev/sdb

emhttpd: spinning down /dev/sdc

emhttpd: sdspin /dev/sdc down: 1

 

Thats very similar to what was posted here:

Same error message. Looks like error code 1 for me. As a result, the disk is spun down correctly despite to this msg and spins up when accessed the next time. But then it will never spin down again till the system is restarted.

 

My second disk (internal Samsung SATA-SSD as cache, /deb/sdb) is "spinning down" without any issues multiple times: 15 Minutes later it get the following in the syslog:

Quote

emhttpd: spinning down /dev/sdb

 

But /dev/sdc is not listed anymore.

I'm really thinking about buying a Unraid license, great conecpt, but only if i cannot rely on a working USB spindown. Any ideas?

 

Thx

Edited January 9 by Pterodactylus

[deBabba]

Hi there,

I'm exactly in the same situation my WD Elements 5TB runs all the time. The spin down all disks Button works for the internal M.2 SSD and the WD disk spinns down and after 2 seconds it restarts again.

If the Array is started in Maintenance Mode, the Spin Down also works for the WD elements drive.

Any news on this topic?

 

My Trial Key is running out of time and I wonder if I should continue with Unraid and buy a Key

[trurl]

Start the array in normal (not maintenance) mode and

 

Attach Diagnostics to your NEXT post in this thread.

[trurl]

Also, USB not recommended for array or pools for many reasons. This is probably more about specific USB implementations and not about Unraid.

[Peter05]

1 hour ago, deBabba said:

Hi there,

I'm exactly in the same situation my WD Elements 5TB runs all the time. The spin down all disks Button works for the internal M.2 SSD and the WD disk spinns down and after 2 seconds it restarts again.

If the Array is started in Maintenance Mode, the Spin Down also works for the WD elements drive.

Any news on this topic?

 

My Trial Key is running out of time and I wonder if I should continue with Unraid and buy a Key

Hello deBabba,

 

I tested Unraid with a WD My Passwort Ultra USB-Hdd. I thing the WD Hdds are a peace of s**t.

Now running with Seagate and spin down works as expected.

My Cash drive does not spin down. Might be influenced on the dockers running on the M2. Checking this is a task for future-me.

 

For now, this setup (USB HDD, no parity, non-ecc ram) is what covers my current requirements. And a license was worth the money.
(And yes, setup is not recommended and not supported…)

[deBabba]

Thnks for the fast reply.

It seems that a service or something else tries to connect to the disk, but there is no Docker or VM installed, just the one disk without parity

 

 

 

 

Thanks for your patience🙏

dell-diagnostics-20240126-1641.zip

[trurl]

6 minutes ago, deBabba said:

no Docker or VM installed

But Docker and VM Manager are both enabled, and system share has files on disk1

[deBabba]

Puh, this explaines why there is an access to the disk, but the System says:

• No Docker containers installed
• No Virtual Machines installed

The disc was formerly used in a test setup and maybe there is kind of garbage left 🤔

Is there a way to clean that up?

 

Thank you so much

[trurl]

If you have Docker and/or VM Manager enabled in Settings, then docker.img and/or libvirt.img are open files. These open files are both configured for the system User Share, which has files on disk1. You should move all system share files off the array.

 

Mover ignores shares that have nothing set for Secondary since those shares have no setting for Mover action.

 

Also, nothing can move open files, so you have to disable Docker and VM Manager in Settings.

[deBabba]

Okay, Docker and VM Manager are disabled, so that that there should be no acces by those services to the system share.

Stopped the Array

started the Array again

Spin down

the disk went to sleep for 3 sec and restarted again.

The weired thing is that even all system shares are assigned to the Cache, they also appear on disk 1

 

 

Since I have no idea how to remove those directories from disk1 and maybe solve the problem, would a clean new setup including formatting the Disc and SSD be the best solution ?

[trurl]

Dynamix File Manager plugin will let you work with folders and files directly on the server.

 

No guarantees with specific USB implementations though. If you insist on using USB for array or pools, look for UASP support.

[deBabba]

16 hours ago, Peter05 said:

Hello deBabba,

 

I tested Unraid with a WD My Passwort Ultra USB-Hdd. I thing the WD Hdds are a peace of s**t.

Now running with Seagate and spin down works as expected.

My Cash drive does not spin down. Might be influenced on the dockers running on the M2. Checking this is a task for future-me.

 

For now, this setup (USB HDD, no parity, non-ecc ram) is what covers my current requirements. And a license was worth the money.
(And yes, setup is not recommended and not supported…)

 

Hi Peter,

thanks for sharing your experiences and sorry for the late reply 👍🙏

Today I will try to fix the issue by moving files, reformatting the disk etc as recommended by trurl.

if nothing solves the problem, I will send back the WD and buy a Seagate disk.

Which model do you use?

 

Best regards from Frankfurt,
Andi

[deBabba]

18 hours ago, trurl said:

If you have Docker and/or VM Manager enabled in Settings, then docker.img and/or libvirt.img are open files. These open files are both configured for the system User Share, which has files on disk1. You should move all system share files off the array.

 

18 hours ago, deBabba said:

The disc was formerly used in a test setup and maybe there is kind of garbage left 🤔

Is there a way to clean that up?

 

I cleaned up the drive completely by reformatting. It now seems to work properly, the disc spins down after the chosen delay time.

I'll keep an eye on it 👁️

 

Thanks again for all your time 🙏

[deBabba]

I was far to optimistic 😢

After a short time the disk behaves as before, so I followed the recommendation to use it in an UAD setup. This makes it even worse, there is a periodic read access to the disk and it it continoues spinning even when the System is shut down !!

So this disc seems to be a garbage for an unraid use case.