Recommende Budget Build - Alternate Processor?

[Vibe]

Hi everyone,

 

I am just starting the process of upgrading my current unRAID server - moving up from a Dell SC440.  I am planning on following the Recommended "Budget Box" Build http://lime-technology.com/wiki/index.php?title=Hardware_Compatibility#Recommended_Builds, but am thinking about upgrading the processor to a multi-core.  I would like to try running Handbrake on my server allowing me to encode various videos that I have. 

 

I plan on using the same motherboard (BIOSTAR A760G M2+) but was looking at a different AMD processor (AMD Athlon II X2 235E Energy Efficient Regor 2.7 GHz 2x1MB L2 Cache Socket AM3 45W Triple-Core Processor) - http://www.amazon.com/AMD-Athlon-Efficient-Triple-Core-Processor/dp/B002PA7U8I/.  Does anyone by chance have experience with this processor? 

 

This CPU looks pretty interesting - 45W like the AMD Sempron 140 - but multiple cores for a bump in "horsepower."  Please excuse my inexperience, but will unRAID be able to fully utilize the multiple cores when encoding video?  Is there an alternative that would be better suited for encoding? (short of a core i7 - which would sure be nice to have! )

 

Thank you for any help and/or suggestions!

 

[queeg]

unRAID will use a single core only and it uses a tiny amount.  Other applications will get to use the additional cores.  I agree they look like good cpu choices.  

[Vibe]

Hi queeg - Thank you for the information.

 

I completely forgot that unRAID will only use a single core - but other applications can utilize multiple cores.  I just noticed in your signature that you are using an Asus M4A78L-M - and I read your post in the forum about compatibility with unRAID.  I have mostly used ASUS boards in the past, and have never tried Biostar products.  How do you like Asus board so far?  Have you had any instability issues?  Do you know if the PCIe slot is compatible with the Supermicro AOC-SASLP-MV8 add-on Card?

 

I was also contemplating moving to an Intel i3-530 CPU with an H55 chipset motherboard.  While the initial price would be higher, the rendering capability would be great with Handbrake.  I also understand that the power usage is rather low at idle.  This is the route I want to take with my HTPC build - would this be "overkill" for an unRAID server (considering H.264 rendering with Handbrake)?

 

Thanks again! 

[BRiT]

I don't think an Intel i3 530 would be overkill for an unRAID system that serves as a handbrake encoding station too. I think it's the sweet-spot between performance and power efficiency.

 

I'm currently using a Core 2 Duo 2.4Ghz for my handbrake encoding and wish I had something faster.

 

As for unRAID only using a single core, it only needs one, but can take advantage of multiple cores via SAMBA configured for async i/o.

[Vibe]

Thank you for your input BRiT - after reviewing all of the CPU/Motherboard options I am really contemplating going this direction (Intel i3 530).  Having the ability to render during off-time would be great.  I have been rendering with an "old" Core Duo (not Core 2 Duo) laptop and it is somewhat painful  .

 

I didn't know about the SAMBA configuration that you mention - I will have research this to learn more.  I haven't even begun "tinkering" with the many unRAID add-ons that are available, but I'm sure the Intel i3 530 would be beneficial.

[queeg]

I just noticed in your signature that you are using an Asus M4A78L-M - and I read your post in the forum about compatibility with unRAID.  I have mostly used ASUS boards in the past, and have never tried Biostar products.  How do you like Asus board so far?  Have you had any instability issues?  Do you know if the PCIe slot is compatible with the Supermicro AOC-SASLP-MV8 add-on Card?

The Asus board has been rock solid.  Lots of people are also using the Biostar budget board.  

I have one of my sata expansion cards in both PCIe slots so I would say the SASLP should probably work.

 

Edit:  But also look at this board.

 

 

I was also contemplating moving to an Intel i3-530 CPU with an H55 chipset motherboard.

 

If you have a Fry's near you then watch for this combo to go on sale which it does quite often.  I've seen it twice for $114.  It's an advertised special they run.

http://lime-technology.com/forum/index.php?topic=6871.0

 

 

 

[Rajahal]

If you are willing to pony up the cash, I think the i3 is your best option.  Keep in mind this requires a complete redesign of your server, since you'll need a different motherboard and likely different RAM as well.  As BRiT said, it is the sweet spot and perfectly adapted for your server.

 

If you want to save some money, the CPU you linked looks fine.  I agree that the Sempron 140 is a bit underpowered for video encoding.  Your current laptop may even be faster.

 

Both Asus and Biostar boards are reputable in my opinion.  I prefer Biostar because I have used them more, but I trust both.

[Vibe]

queeg - thanks for posting the link to the Asus board - it looks great for sure.  However, after spending "way too much time" reviewing the overwhelming number of hardware options available today (GEEZE!  I remember when the choice was "PII - what speed?") - I couldn't pass up a good deal from Amazon. 

 

As per Rajahal's build(s) (your post in the "Pimp your rig" forum sold me!) I purchased the BIOSTAR A760G M2+, AMD Sempron 140 and Cooler Master Centurion 590 - all for $150.00 (shipped).  My thinking is that I will first go the Intel i3/i5 route for my HTTPC build (XBMC for sure) - and may go with the board queeg mentioned.  Then as $$$ permits, I can upgrade my unRAID server to Intel i3 specs, and use the Biostar/Sempron for an interested family member's 1st unRAID server.

 

Now I sit at my workstation, dribbling as I continuously refresh FedEx's delivery tracking page. 

 

Thanks again for all the insight everyone, as always it is GREATLY appreciated!

[Rajahal]

I'm guessing you meant this post?  That server (which I built for someone else) did turn out pretty nice.  My actual server is fairly ugly by comparison (though it has seen a few revisions since those photos - I have two 3-in-2 hot swap bays in the upper drive chambers now).  I also now use the Biostar A760G M2+ and the Sempron 140 as in the budget build design, not the Gigabyte board shown in those photos.  Guess I need to update my post.

[BRiT]

If you're going to be building a HTPC which does nothing but play videos stored on the unRAID server, you don't need a powerhouse system. You can even make do with an Intel Atom so long as it has an Nvidia ION graphics. XBMC runs great on them.

 

Here's a review of such a system at TechReport. It's usually priced around $220 to $230. All that's needed to add is Memory, HardDrive, and OS. Though a better value may be an Acer AspireRevo which includes a wireless mouse and keyboard. Some builds even include the HDD and RAM. I think a few others run them as their HTPC front-ends.

 

If you went with an i3, you'd still need to add a case and power supply.

[Vibe]

YES that is it - the second photo is what sold me.  Beautiful, wide-open space - the system can breathe.  I have always wanted to use the Centurion 590 case, but the miniscule size of the Biostar motherboard really sold me.  I also started thinking about the low power usage as well - especially by way of the thread at silentpcreview (http://www.silentpcreview.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=54409).  Your personal server is definitely a winner - the capacity is tremendous (I wish I had the space for a 4U rackmount!).

 

What I would REALLY like to do (too $$$ at this point), would be to use 2.5" Western Digital Scorpio laptop drives in an unRAID server.  Can you imagine how "cute" 16 of these little things stacked up would be?  (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822136545)

[Rajahal]

Haha, I've thought about that too - total waste of money and slower as well, but a server full of 2.5" drives would just look awesome.

 

My normal server is in an Antec p180 - not a 4U rackmount case.  I do actually have a Norco 4220 server waiting in the wings - I either want to migrate my server into that case, or sell it off.  I just don't want to throw down the $200+ on the dual AOC-SASLP-MV8's that the Norco 4220 server needs to be complete.

 

I also highly recommend the Acer Aspire Revo as an HTPC (see the link in my sig for more details).  For only $200 plus a $50 remote, it outperforms custom HTPCs I've built for $500 or more.  FYI, though, the included mouse and keyboard are wired, not wireless.  However, you only need the keyboard for the initial 10 minute set up - after that you can do everything with the remote.  The keyboard I now use as my server's console keyboard, since it is so small and easily stowed away.  The mouse I used as a laptop backup mouse for a while (since it is also small and doesn't need batteries), but then gave it to a friend who needed it more than I.

[queeg]

queeg - thanks for posting the link to the Asus board - it looks great for sure.  However, after spending "way too much time" reviewing the overwhelming number of hardware options available today (GEEZE!  I remember when the choice was "PII - what speed?") - I couldn't pass up a good deal from Amazon.  

 

fwiw, I bought a Biostar A760G M2+ a couple weeks ago for $40 from an individual via Amazon.  It came new in box with the seal unbroken and the plastic straps around the box.  I'm going to be using it when I get around to installing my Icy Docks in my TinyTen case.  

I haven't decided if I'm going to use the Sempron 140 I have or get a dual proc like you found.  I've also been trying to decide if I can install vmware server on unRAID and if so that might make a dual or triple cpu a good choice.

 

As to the HTPC idea, I'm interested in those angles as well.

[Vibe]

BRiT - That Zotac HTPC looks awesome (thanks for the link!)  The price is very reasonable and the size is very alluring.  I will definitely look into these.  I was originally thinking that I would go the Intel i3 route for the HTPC, but now may hold off.  I have a SonyPS3 that can handle Blu-Ray disks, so maybe the "logical" thing would be going this route.

 

Rajahal - in one of my first posts in this forum you mentioned XBMC.  Being a true "noobster" I had no clue that something like this was available - WOW - blew my mind.  Since then I have been bitten my the "home theater" bug (in conjunction with the "unRAID" bug of course).  I was also thinking about going with the Acer Aspire Revo (maybe the dual-core).  With the success of the unit I'm sure we are going to see a big wave of new products coming to market that can support XBMC and the off-shoots.

 

While the Antec p180 is a great case (I don't have one myself but have seen them up close), it just doesn't have the same MUCHISIMO as the Norco 4220.  If I had one I would probably take guests to my basement server room (aka creepy basement closet) just for a private viewing - before movie watching time.  A friend of mine recently purchased one of the garden variety NAS boxes (whopping 1TB of space 2x500GB) and was pretty vocal about how cool it/he was with the new "Network backup system" he implemented.  I told him what I was doing with unRAID (potential for 15TB space using inexpensive 1TB drives) and he pretty much hasn't breached the subject since.

 

Ahhh...not only are we taking up space - we're having fun in the process.

[Vibe]

queeg - Awesome deal that you found!  The cheapest that I found yesterday was $55.00 (shipped).  Oh well...live and learn.  However, these boards must be getting fairly scarce, so I'm happy with my purchase.  I haven't even begun looking into the accessories (e.g. the Icy Dock enclosures).  I can see I am going to have to start budgeting for this new addiction!

 

I was also looking at some of the new low power AMD CPU's that were on Amazon.  If memory serves me correctly there were dual and triple core (45W versions) but shipping was listed as "typically ships in two weeks."

[BRiT]

Vibe, since you have a PS3, you may want to look into getting PS3MediaServer running on your unRAID. That should provide additional media streaming capabilities with the PS3 being the HTPC front-end.

[queeg]

queeg - Awesome deal that you found!  The cheapest that I found yesterday was $55.00 (shipped).  Oh well...live and learn.  However, these boards must be getting fairly scarce, so I'm happy with my purchase.  I haven't even begun looking into the accessories (e.g. the Icy Dock enclosures).  I can see I am going to have to start budgeting for this new addiction!

 

I was also looking at some of the new low power AMD CPU's that were on Amazon.  If memory serves me correctly there were dual and triple core (45W versions) but shipping was listed as "typically ships in two weeks."

 

At $40 it was an accidental find.  I couldn't pass it up.  I think you will see it turn up from time to time as the last remaining stocks are dumped to lower tier budget outlets.  

 

I started without enclosures but I'm sold on them now.  Partly because I have additional hdd's in my unRAID machine that arent' part of the array.  I want to be able to hotswap them.  Also, early on in my unRAID experience I had a drive in which the locking data connector had been stripped (by me pulling too hard) a little and just brushing against the cable a little would essentially unplug the drive causing unRAID to disable the array.  Before I determined what the problem was it had resulted in data loss.  

Having the drive pushed into a drive bay prevents that problem and the drive has no problems now.  Now I suppose it's possible to strip out the sata connector on the back of the drive bay but actually they never get unplugged so having them fixes my 1) being in a hurry, and 2) I can still fiddle in my case which I like to do.  

[Vibe]

BRiT - you are right on the mark - I have been tinkering with PS3MediaServer and am really liking it.  I have to work on the customizations that are available, but for now I have DVD rips working well.  One thing that I must say, after learning how to backup DVD's, it is amazing the variances in quality!  Some DVD rips look fantastic, close to Blu-Ray quality.  However, others look pretty shabby overall.  I guess it is like having a decent audio turntable - you can hear the quality differences between albums.

 

queeg - I know what you mean about the enclosures - they are wonderful.  I use them on web servers and they are a life saver for sure.  I figure with my new case I will be able to upgrade over time and purchase the hot-swap cages. 

[mcs]

One thing that I must say, after learning how to backup DVD's, it is amazing the variances in quality!  Some DVD rips look fantastic, close to Blu-Ray quality.  However, others look pretty shabby overall.  I guess it is like having a decent audio turntable - you can hear the quality differences between albums.

 

Unlike analogue turntables, unless your using compression, backing up DVDs shouldn't result in any change to quality.  What are you using to backup DVDs? Are you using any form of compression? Are you looking at the result of different outputs (composite, component s-video, dvi, hdmi)?

 

[Rajahal]

I think he means that the DVDs themselves are of varying quality, which I have noticed as well.

[neilt0]

DVDs are so 1997! Blu-ray all the way! 

[Vibe]

Rajahal is correct - I meant that I am surprised at the difference in quality of the actual DVDs.  I have some from several years back that are pretty poor.  I rip the full DVD (main movie) using DVDFab (no compression).

 

LOL @ neilt0!  I agree - I would greatly enjoy ripping some blu-ray disks.  I just need a blu-ray player that can do this  .  Ahhh well...off to spend more $$$.

[PeterB]

I think he means that the DVDs themselves are of varying quality, which I have noticed as well.

 

Indeed, especially those DVDs produced for the Philippine market, where VCD is by far the most common format!

[poofyhairguy]

DVDs are so 1997! Blu-ray all the way! 

 

But even Blu Rays are all over the map.

 

Some are x264 masterpieces (Avatar), some are huge MPEG2 encodes (older Disney Blu Rays), and some are huge piles of VC1 crap (Harry Potter). Some of older movies are incredible rescans, some look like the freaking DVD upscaled professionally.

 

And don't get me started on Blu Ray audio. Three different HD audio standards (LPCM, DTS HD, and Dolby True HD) to mess with. The last two require very special hardware to bitstream properly, and because DTS HD is super proprietary not much software can decode it. That is why I rip all my Blu Rays to mkvs with 8 channel FLAC- at least FLAC is lossless audio I have trusted for years and everything I care about (XBMC) can decode it.

 

The amount of differences between Blu Rays when you really start ripping them (I own over 150) turns out to be pretty vast. All are better than DVD though- in the DVD days I didn't really care about TV and Movies as much as now for that reason....

[neilt0]

I dunno about that. I have over 500 Blu-rays and there are only a few that are junk.

 

The Alliance stuff out of Canada is all garbage, but It's rare for a major studio to put out a recent release that's not good, and I'm a quality nut with 20/20 vision.

 

Gangs of New York, Fifth Element and Gladiator were sub-par releases, but all got re-issued, most with a free replacement program.

 

The studios should realise now that we won't put up with crappy transfers.

 

"The last two require very special hardware to bitstream properly"

 

My "cheap" Popcorn Hours plus a really cheap Onkyo amp handle these audio formats perfectly. Nothing special there.