The USB drive thread?

[Taurondir]

I arrived into this discussion from another angle, but I thought i'd add to it:

I basically work as a PC tech, so I keep buying random flash drives to move stuff about and occasionally to reinstall OS's on random stuff I need to test or play with.

 

I have a tendency to just go "to a local store" and around here in Australia it's places like Kmart, Coles, Woolworths.

 

Kmart has Verbatim USB Drives, and I have a bunch of sizes from different times, largest is a couple of 64GB (because they went on sale) and they booted fine on what I have just laying on a desk right now (Core 2 Quad 6600 socket 775, on a Gigabyte G31M-S2L) and also was booting on 3 other customer machines (various ages) I did recently, and it boots on my TUF X470-Plus AMD mobo.

 

My motto has basically been that local stores like Coles/Kmart have a 1Y "no fuss" replacement policy on cheap items, so when it comes to things like USB drives I can just buy a single one, do a bunch of tests for my needs - ie boot drives for installations - and if they work, go back and buy a bunch, and easily get it replaced if one RNG fails - they wont even blink funny as long as you have BOTH the packaging AND the receipt - within the 1Y warranty. I mean, every 1-2 you will find a drive twice the size at the same price, so why not get them if you have uses for them.

 

If I decide to run Unraid (I'm thinking about it) id just have the "live stick" in all the time and I'd back it up to a removable clone (keep it unplugged to make it last longer) and just swap it in if I get an RNG failure on the live one. Get another stick to replace the dead, rinse and repeat.

[trurl]

5 minutes ago, Taurondir said:

I'd back it up to a removable clone (keep it unplugged to make it last longer) and just swap it in if I get an RNG failure on the live one.

No need to have it backed up to another flash drive. You can download a zipped backup and use that on another flash drive when needed.

 

Of course, if you change flash drives, however you do the backup, you have to transfer the license.

[Taurondir]

20 minutes ago, trurl said:

No need to have it backed up to another flash drive. You can download a zipped backup and use that on another flash drive when needed.

 

Of course, if you change flash drives, however you do the backup, you have to transfer the license.

 

Oh ok, did not know that. I'm just throwing the idea of running FreeNAS and also Unraid for playing around with, and I dont think the $65 or whatever AU dollars are for Unraid are a terrible compromise, although I was worried about how Unraid "stores" the key, because If something totally RNG happens I can't get to that key, does it means I cant get to my "data" until I figure it out?

 

Can you just plug the disks into another machine and read them? I mean its NOT terribly important as there wont be any "vital" data there and I'm not going the whole "redudancy and safety" route as I wont be running a "storage system", its going to be something that I just prod and poke at random times to see how it can dance, like checking appliances and Virtual Machines and what not.

 

If I ever decide to make a "proper setup" I'd get a 6-8 core setup, 16--32 GB of memory and a bunch of actual drives to string together but yea, I think all my actual important life  data can probably just fit on a 32GB flash drive at this stage, and I'm just using DropBox to stash that.

[JonathanM]

7 hours ago, Taurondir said:

If something totally RNG happens I can't get to that key, does it means I cant get to my "data" until I figure it out?

As long as you have a copy of the files on the key, you can set up a new key, and on first boot it will walk you through transferring the license to that new key. You can do that once a year automatically through the Limetech servers, if you mess up a key before the year is up you would need to talk directly to support and explain what happened, and they can manually transfer the license.

7 hours ago, Taurondir said:

 

Can you just plug the disks into another machine and read them?

Yes, the data and pool disks are all standard linux formats, currently either XFS or BTRFS, so any OS capable of mounting and reading those file systems can access the data.

 

 

[trurl]

1 hour ago, JonathanM said:

Yes, the data and pool disks are all standard linux formats, currently either XFS or BTRFS, so any OS capable of mounting and reading those file systems can access the data.

Note however that if you mount any array disk outside the array you have invalidated parity

[Rick Sanchez]

On 10/27/2021 at 2:52 AM, winklevos said:

Also interested in what everyone is using, and if the 6.9 version is better with UEFI and 3.0 USBs? 

I had been running off SanDisk Cruzer Glide 3.0 16GB (SDCZ600-016G) for a few years but now my server doesn't want to post with it plugged in. 

I'm going to grab a couple of different models and see what works

 

@Rick Sanchez not sure if you found Testing to find the best USB flash drive to boot an OS like Unraid - YouTube

 

I bought the SanDisk Cruiser Fit 2.0 16GB

[trurl]

Just now, Rick Sanchez said:

 

I bought the SanDisk Cruiser Fit 2.0 16GB

I have been using these on both of my servers for years no problems

[JackSafari]

The setup guide says Unraid requires a flash drive 2GB or larger.

 

Is there any advantage of having a larger USB Flash drive (8BG, 16B, 32GB, 64GB, etc )?

Does using a USB 3.0 Flash drive make any difference?

 

[trurl]

11 hours ago, JackSafari said:

any advantage of having a larger USB Flash drive

no

11 hours ago, JackSafari said:

USB 3.0 Flash drive make any difference?

no, but booting from USB3 port may be less reliable on some hardware.

 

Might be some additional useful info for you in the rest of this thread

 

 

[ConnerVT]

I will support @trurl in his thoughts.

 

USB 2.0 is generally more stable/reliable, especially in Linux environments.  As there isn't much to gain by having the greater throughput speeds of 3.0 as no large amounts of data are being moved around, sticking with a 2.0 drive has little to lose.

 

Another benefit of older small 2.0 USB drives is that they generally have older tech memory chips.  I work in semiconductor manufacturing.  The newer, smaller memory cell allows you to pack more of them on a die.  But they are more prone to damage by heat, static charge, etc.  The older technology will likely out live a newer design.

 

For under $8 USD, you can pick up a name brand 8 or 16 GB USB 2.0 flash drive.  Folks really shouldn't over think this one.

[HDT]

Are any of these good?

• SanDisk Cruzer Blade 32GB USB 2.0 Flash Drive- SDCZ50-032G-B35

• SanDisk 32GB Cruzer Glide USB 2.0 Flash Drive - SDCZ60-032G-B35

• SanDisk 32GB Cruzer Fit USB 2.0 Flash Drive - SDCZ33-032G-G35

Edited May 24, 2022 by HDT

[ChatNoir]

4 hours ago, HDT said:

Are any of these good?

• SanDisk Cruzer Blade 32GB USB 2.0 Flash Drive- SDCZ50-032G-B35

• SanDisk 32GB Cruzer Glide USB 2.0 Flash Drive - SDCZ60-032G-B35

• SanDisk 32GB Cruzer Fit USB 2.0 Flash Drive - SDCZ33-032G-G35

While I am happy of my Cruzer Blade, I have to bring your attention to this PSA :

 

 

Some suggestions on the thread.

 

Just to comment on your proposals characteristics, not considering the brand :

• the Glide's objective seems to be more towards drives that would be transported in a bag and needs to be protected. That's not relevant here.
• as for compact Cruzer Fit vs regular Cruzer Blade, people have divergent opinions on that. Some like that the Fit does not stick too much of the case, other think that the very small size increase temperature and its not that good for electronics

You'll have to decide what fit's best your use case.

[HDT]

Thanks ChatNoir!

 

I just used an old SanDisk Glide 8GB and it booted just fine.  But, I'll buy the Samsung BAR Plus USB 3.1 to be on the safe side.

 

Kind of odd that it's the top recommended model since I've seen several references recommend the use of USB 2.0 flash drives.

 

Do we stick these in the USB 3.x ports or the USB 2.0 ports or does it not matter?

 

Thank you!

[ChatNoir]

3 hours ago, HDT said:

I just used an old SanDisk Glide 8GB and it booted just fine.

In that case, if it works, I'd say there is no reason to change. The PSA is about not getting a GUID, if your flashdrive has one you should be good.

 

As for USB3.x vs USB2.0 :

• it seems that USB2 drives do not run as hot as USB3.x and that's generally good
• USB2.0 tend to be more reliable, but that's very dependent from board to board and no pattern to know in advance
• the flash drive is mainly used at startup to load the OS to RAM and then update configuration changes. Speed is not really important
• but many people have no issues with USB3.x. I for one have no USB2 on my mainboard and I am doing fine.

[Leo007]

Some people are having issues with the Samsung BAR Plus like reported in this thread:

 

 

Probably it's the best to go with USB 2.0 Sticks like the SanDisk Cruzer Fit or KINGSTON Data Traveler SE9.

[dopeytree]

Do also make sure to turn off fast booting in bios. I have found that sometimes stop a restart happening the screen is just black.

 

I think kingston are better than sandisk - they seem to use SLC chips in most of their sticks by default.

 

I'm now using an ATP usb stick: https://uk.rs-online.com/web/c/computing-peripherals/memory-data-storage/usb-sticks/?applied-dimensions=4294342949

[C4RBON]

In my recent (and ongoing) new home server build, I am focusing on reliability and uptime.  One of my areas of improvement is the boot drive.  I had been using a 32 gb Sandisk "Ultra Flair" for the last 3 years without issue.  But for my new build, I wanted something a bit more... trustworthy.  In my searching for a new boot drive, I found these Delkin USB sticks:

 

Industrial USB Flash Drive | Delkin Devices- Rugged Controlled Storage

https://www.delkin.com/products/industrial-usb-flash-drive/

 

https://www.delkin.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/01/401-0459-00-Rev-F-B300-Series-Industrial-USB-Drive-Engineering-Specification.pdf

 

Highlights:

- Industrial SLC

- Controlled BOM (they won't change the parts inside or specs without notification)

- Wide operating temperature range (-40 to 85 C)

- Error correction, wear leveling, block management, redundant firmware, dynamic data refresh

- Mine is stamped with Made in USA (I'm sure with some overseas parts)

- Has a GUID for Unraid licensing

 

Downsides:

- They aren't fast, despite being USB 3.0 (75 MB/s read, 60 MB/s write, sequential, for the fastest 16/32 GB versions)

- They are long and plastic.  There is a "short" version that is still fairly long.  No cap retention.

- Expensive.  Here are the prices on Digi-Key:

 

 2 GB - $59

 4 GB - $85

 8 GB - $139

16 GB - $239

32 GB - $354

 

I settled on the 8 GB as a good balance between capacity, performance, and cost.  While I winced at spending $139 on an 8 GB flash drive in 2023, it's easier to accept if you consider it an "industrial boot drive", and not something used occasionally to share Linux distros with friends.  I'm sure there are consumer drives with similar features, but I like that these Delkin drives are documented and have a controlled BOM.

 

Mine will live in my server in my 20 deg C basement for the foreseeable future.  I'll report back if it ever has any issues.

Edited March 6 by C4RBON