Lolight Posted August 31, 2023 Share Posted August 31, 2023 LincPlus have announced a new 6-bay SSD NAS system that will come with Unraid pre-installed. https://www.lincplustech.com/products/lincstation-network-attached-storage-pre-order Robbie at NASCompares has been provided some info directly from LincPlus. They claim that it's powered by Unraid Standard (??) Version. They state: "The NAS will include a license and customers do not need to buy another license." @SpencerJ Are you aware of the development? Has the product and its configuration been tested and/or approved for full compatibility with Unraid? Is the license legit? Did they mis-label the license version? 1 Quote Link to comment
SpencerJ Posted August 31, 2023 Share Posted August 31, 2023 10 hours ago, Lolight said: Are you aware of the development? Has the product and its configuration been tested and/or approved for full compatibility with Unraid? Is the license legit? Did they mis-label the license version? Yes- I’m aware. It’s in the process of being tested. It will be a legitimate Basic license as long as testing goes smoothly. 2 1 Quote Link to comment
Lolight Posted October 16, 2023 Author Share Posted October 16, 2023 On 8/31/2023 at 2:33 PM, SpencerJ said: It’s in the process of being tested. It will be a legitimate Basic license as long as testing goes smoothly. Do you have any news on testing? It's been a while... Thank you. Quote Link to comment
SpencerJ Posted October 18, 2023 Share Posted October 18, 2023 On 10/15/2023 at 8:07 PM, Lolight said: Do you have any news on testing? It's been a while... Thank you. Hey there, It's sounding like they will be opening up pre-orders soon via indiegogo and depending on how that goes, production should ramp in early to mid next year. Quote Link to comment
Featured Comment SpencerJ Posted October 25, 2023 Featured Comment Share Posted October 25, 2023 On 10/18/2023 at 11:35 AM, SpencerJ said: Hey there, It's sounding like they will be opening up pre-orders soon via indiegogo and depending on how that goes, production should ramp in early to mid next year. Campaign is live https://t.co/sqY3pN69s5 Quote Link to comment
Lolight Posted October 26, 2023 Author Share Posted October 26, 2023 The latest review: Quote Link to comment
Kilrah Posted October 26, 2023 Share Posted October 26, 2023 9 hours ago, SpencerJ said: Campaign is live https://t.co/sqY3pN69s5 Kinda deceptive marketing there IMO. As we all know here what they advertise as features can totally be set up but the way it's presented is "does it out of the box" while people here who help others set these things up on the daily will know it's far from that. Since this is obviously oriented towards more of the average person it should at least have notes that say those depend on the user installing and setting up popular apps like Nextcloud, Jellyfin,... and not a built-in/one click solution. Quote Link to comment
diste66 Posted October 26, 2023 Share Posted October 26, 2023 There is also the claim of 20TB of usable space with the use of 4TB drives, which I believe might imply all disks in a single array with 1 parity disk. I do see a lot of conflicting opinions on whether it's a good idea to mix SATA and NVMEs like that or if it's advisable to put SSDs in an array at all. Would be good to know what the recommended configuration for this is. A single array with all SSDs like they seem to suggest? An array with 2.5" SATA HDDs and a ZFS pool with the 4 NVME slots? Other? Quote Link to comment
JonathanM Posted October 26, 2023 Share Posted October 26, 2023 7 hours ago, diste66 said: Would be good to know what the recommended configuration for this is. There isn't a "one size fits all" or even a "one size fits most" answer, because of all the different use cases. At the moment with 6.12.4 still requiring an array disk, I would tend to recommend putting an extra USB memory stick as disk1 in the array, and defining various pools with the rest of the media, keeping like with like, so one or more pools with the NVME devices, and one or more pools with the SATA SSD's. The main parity array is much better suited to spinning rust, so an all solid state media machine is kind of a special animal, requiring different care and feeding than most here on the forums are familiar with. 2 1 Quote Link to comment
bidmead Posted February 19 Share Posted February 19 (edited) @JonathanM, this question seems to me to be crucial. If I understand the problem correctly, there's an essential mismatch between the (great) idea of a parity checking hard drive (or drive pair) that is responsible for looking after changes of data on an array of drives and the way an SSD drive works. While spinning rust can without too much contortion be thought of as capable of (re)writing single parity bits one at a time, the same process on an SSD is much more of a palaver. The picture I'm getting is of a future all-SSD NAS that uses only unassigned drives pooled using conventional Linux storage techniques (which are, of course, RAID-based).* All the other good UnRAID stuff (readily installable docker apps and so on maintained by a vibrant community) should continue to thrive. But what happens to the name "UnRAID"? -- Chris * LATER: Foolish error on my part. These pools are categorised as "user-defined pools", not "unassigned drives". Edited February 23 by bidmead Foolish error, as noted. Quote Link to comment
JonathanM Posted February 19 Share Posted February 19 36 minutes ago, bidmead said: The picture I'm getting is of a future all-SSD NAS that uses only unassigned drives pooled using conventional Linux storage techniques (which are, of course, RAID-based). All the other good UnRAID stuff (readily installable docker apps and so on maintained by a vibrant community) should continue to thrive. But what happens to the name "UnRAID"? Why should the name Unraid be an issue? BTW, unassigned devices is only recommended as a way to attach temporary media, permanent storage should be put into various pools, which can use XFS for single device pools, and BTRFS or ZFS for multi-device pools, all of which can participate in the user share system, where unassigned devices can't. Honestly, I'm not sure what you are asking. The unique single or double parity spinning rust pool type will still be available for those that wish to use it. Quote Link to comment
bidmead Posted February 19 Share Posted February 19 (edited) 7 hours ago, JonathanM said: Honestly, I'm not sure what you are asking. The unique single or double parity spinning rust pool type will still be available for those that wish to use it. Apologies for not being clear. I was suggesting that the parity solution for which spinning rust is well-suited won't be useful for all-solid-state NAS devices, which will instead have to rely on RAID-based storage pool solutions on unassigned devices. The recommendation about unassigned drives you mention seems to me to refer to their use in current conventional HD-based UnRAID configurations. It appears that solid state storage will change that, particularly in future versions of the operating system that make the main (optionally parity-protected) array itself an option. > Why should the name Unraid be an issue? In which case the name "UnRAID" might be thought to be inappropriate. -- Chris Edited February 19 by bidmead Removed a redundant comma. Quote Link to comment
Kilrah Posted February 19 Share Posted February 19 Most people won't do all solid-state, more storage for the same cost trumps fast access for most cases, the array has a lot of life ahead of it. This particular product aims somewhere else but it'll ikely be a niche. And you _can_ use SSDs in the array if you want, will just be a little less fast than in a ZFS pool. Quote Link to comment
bidmead Posted February 20 Share Posted February 20 Thanks, @Kilrah. But I'd suggest that the "most people" argument here demonstrates its usual weakness. UnRAID itself isn't designed for "most people". And the Linkstation N1 is certainly not designed for spinning rust users. Lime Technologies choosing to tie in with this device appears to signal that it's looking to evolve UnRAID to properly include all-SSD NASes. That's not to say there's any thought of abandoning HDs and the parity-protected array for which HDs are well-suited. But with the N1, Lime is taking on the challenge of SSDs. These storage devices can, as you suggest, be kluged into a conventional UnRAID main array, but they don't bit-flip at all well and engineers wince at the idea. -- Chris Quote Link to comment
bidmead Posted February 23 Share Posted February 23 (edited) I need to correct myself here. I've returned to Unraid after an absence of a couple of years following a hardware failure, and haven't yet got my head around some of the newer developments. I had assumed that ZFS, XFS and BTRFS pools, not forming part of the main Unraid array, would be categorised as "unassigned devices". I've since learned that this binary categorisation is wrong: there's a third category of "user-defined pools", to which these newer storage formats belong. This makes nonsense of my response to @JonathanM, so my apologies are due. Let me rally my thoughts and see if I can straighten out what I was trying to say, which I think remains valid: The core idea of a parity protected array depends entirely on the ability of a dedicated parity-maintaining device (comprising one or two drives) to track bit switching in close to real time as new data are written to any of the several other drives comprising the array. Hard drives are well designed to do this, at their own pace. Solid state devices using NAND can emulate this, and probably with impressive speed. However, although the SSD controller can comfortably write a zero bit into a cell that previously stored a one, it has to copy out an entire block of data to a new set of cells if it's required to overwrite a zero with a one. This elaborate choreography leaves wastelands of out-dated data that will need to be TRIMmed by the operating system from time to time. Copying an entire block that subsequently has to be erased by a high voltage before it can be reused, just to accommodate a single bit-flip, accelerates wear and significantly shortens the life of the device. So while SSDs are valuable for storing chunks of data in normal use, they are not a worthy technology for bit-by-bit parity matching. This suggests that Unraid implemented on an all-solid-state NAS should not employ the traditional parity-checked main array. Instead, its data will optimally be stored in one or more user-defined pools. Very likely these pools will employ RAID configurations. That's my thinking. In attempting to express it as clearly as possible I notice I've fallen into a tone that sounds authoritative. This is spurious. As I say, I'm still trying to get to grips with all this and there's lots of room for me to be wrong. Please straighten me out as appropriate. -- Chris Edited February 23 by bidmead Had to sort out my ones and zeros in item 2. Quote Link to comment
JonathanM Posted February 23 Share Posted February 23 The parity protected array will be just another pool type soon™, with no requirement to use it. It will still be available for those wishing to use it for all the original benefits it gives for spinning rust, separate file systems per volume, ability to spin down when not accessed, etc. The current requirement of a single volume assigned as disk1 to start the pools will go away. Quote Link to comment
bidmead Posted February 23 Share Posted February 23 Thanks for the steer, @JonathanM. Categorising the parity-protected array as another kind of user-defined pool makes a lot of sense. Meanwhile I'm following your advice (and Spencer's) with a dummy 4GB USB stick standing in for the conventional disk1 array. -- Chris Quote Link to comment
bidmead Posted March 8 Share Posted March 8 Tested Technology has posted part 1 of its review of Unraid on the LincStation N1. Comments, here or on the Tested Technology Web site, would be very welcome indeed. -- Chris Quote Link to comment
Burgherh Posted March 18 Share Posted March 18 On 3/8/2024 at 12:24 PM, bidmead said: Tested Technology has posted part 1 of its review of Unraid on the LincStation N1. Comments, here or on the Tested Technology Web site, would be very welcome indeed. -- Chris How's the fan noise? I'm tempted by this device as a living room unit, which means it has to be quiet. Quote Link to comment
Terebi Posted May 1 Share Posted May 1 How does this work as SSD only when unraid requires an array disk, and the TRIM issue? Quote Link to comment
Kilrah Posted May 1 Share Posted May 1 You can make a zfs pool that'll be trimmed and use a dummy flash drive as array until the requirement is removed. Quote Link to comment
tgitsupport Posted July 9 Share Posted July 9 Hi All I wonder if someone can help me, I purchased one of these boxes but I have forgotten the my root password Does anyone know how to factory reset the box back to default? I've messaged Linc plus but nobody has gotten back to me, there is a little hole on the back on box so pushed a paperclip in but the box just shuts down Don't now what else to do Quote Link to comment
SpencerJ Posted July 9 Share Posted July 9 7 hours ago, tgitsupport said: Hi All I wonder if someone can help me, I purchased one of these boxes but I have forgotten the my root password Does anyone know how to factory reset the box back to default? I've messaged Linc plus but nobody has gotten back to me, there is a little hole on the back on box so pushed a paperclip in but the box just shuts down Don't now what else to do Did you set your own root password or is it still default (123456)? Quote Link to comment
itimpi Posted July 10 Share Posted July 10 If you really have set the root password and cannot remember it then I would have thought the standard Unraid way described here in the online documentation accessible via the Manual link at the bottom of the Unraid GUI should work. In addition every forum page has a DOCS link at the top and a Documentation link at the bottom. Quote Link to comment
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