Intel 12th generation Alder Lake / Hybrid CPU


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12 hours ago, Wintersdark said:

Alder Lake doesn't work with Jellyfin on Unraid, though.  Still crashes when HW transcoding.

 

Likewise, Plex on Ubuntu now has working HW transcoding. The problem is Kernel + Specific ICR version.  

 

Unraid will crash on Alder Lake if you enable the GPU even WITHOUT actually hardware transcoding.

Ok help me understand how the GPU is enabled without actually hardware transcoding. Is there a way to have unRaid just totally ignore the GPU?

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19 minutes ago, dchamb said:

Ok help me understand how the GPU is enabled without actually hardware transcoding. Is there a way to have unRaid just totally ignore the GPU?

Sure, do nothing.  Don't install Intel GPU Top, don't have modprobe lines to install the GPU drivers.  If you just run Unraid out of the box on 12th gen, and don't do anything with the iGPU then there's no problem at all an 12th gen works very well.

 

Well, I don't know if the current governer works correctly with P/E cores, as I've got a 12400 (only P cores), but it's stable regardless.

 

 

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On 7/13/2022 at 5:14 PM, scott47 said:

Hi everyone,

I'm in the middle of changing my UnRaid server, and I went with the I7-12700.  In my old system I had a cheap NVidia card that seemed to work for some transcoding, but until now I've mostly only downloaded 720p shows.  That's mostly because I share Plex (with just one other person), and that was easier to transcode 🙂 

 

I need help to understand exactly what people are doing:

  1. Can Plex, running on UnRaid 6.10.3, use the iGPU on the 12th gen chips at all?  
    1. I saw something about only when using HDR, but I have no idea if that's correct, or how to enable/disable HDR.
  2. Are the 11th gen chips in the same boat?
  3. Is this problem only with 4K shows?  I'm messing around with those now, but I'm not sure if this problem affects every video format or just some.
  4. Is anyone is using the iGPU on a 12th gen chip at all, is it documented anywhere how they were able to do that?
  5. I've read there are kernel changes that will fix this (?), but I'm still not sure if that is an UnRaid change or a Plex change?

Sorry, I am just completely lost.

 

Thanks for your help!

Scott

Hello friend that is practically answered in the forum

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6 hours ago, xXx said:

Hello friend that is practically answered in the forum

I'm sorry.  I have read every single post in this forum and I was (and I still am) confused. 

 

Honestly, this is technology that I'm not very familiar with, and I haven't worked with very often. 

 

I hoped my post would be a good way to make sure I was on the right track.  At the same time, I apologize, since it appears my post has annoyed you.

 

Thanks!

Scott

 

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9 hours ago, scott47 said:

I'm sorry.  I have read every single post in this forum and I was (and I still am) confused. 

 

Honestly, this is technology that I'm not very familiar with, and I haven't worked with very often. 

 

I hoped my post would be a good way to make sure I was on the right track.  At the same time, I apologize, since it appears my post has annoyed you.

 

Thanks!

Scott

 

It hasn't bothered me, it's just asking the same thing again, greetings

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On 7/14/2022 at 8:42 AM, ich777 said:

On the Plex forums it's never an issue with Plex or any components from them...

 

Absolutely this - also, can confirm it was 10th gen, with the intro of Xe graphics for their integrated GPU's. Intel had already laid the groundwork to support Xe with the open source community (including working with ffmpeg) prior to release to help ensure a "smooth" release. Plex's tweaks to it were out of tree and significantly behind current though, so they received none of those fixes/enhancements.

 

I assume it has to do with their attempts to lock down transcoding to paid plex pass holders.

 

Same issue with their SQLite implementation - they've hacked the hell out of it such that it's basically unsupportable by anyone but them... which means if it goes paws up, you're SOL when it comes to many manual DB repair options.

 

I hate that plex has become the defacto media streaming tool given all this, and wish I could convince enough of my users to move away from it that I could stop supporting it 😓

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4 hours ago, BVD said:

 

Absolutely this - also, can confirm it was 10th gen, with the intro of Xe graphics for their integrated GPU's. Intel had already laid the groundwork to support Xe with the open source community (including working with ffmpeg) prior to release to help ensure a "smooth" release. Plex's tweaks to it were out of tree and significantly behind current though, so they received none of those fixes/enhancements.

 

I assume it has to do with their attempts to lock down transcoding to paid plex pass holders.

 

Same issue with their SQLite implementation - they've hacked the hell out of it such that it's basically unsupportable by anyone but them... which means if it goes paws up, you're SOL when it comes to many manual DB repair options.

 

I hate that plex has become the defacto media streaming tool given all this, and wish I could convince enough of my users to move away from it that I could stop supporting it 😓

What would you move them to? I used Emby for a while but it never really clicked. Are there any other options it there?

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20 minutes ago, scott47 said:

What would you move them to? I used Emby for a while but it never really clicked. Are there any other options it there?

Emby or Jellyfin; generally Jellyfin is what people like.  

 

It doesn't matter though Jellyfin or Emby won't hardware transcode under Unraid either until the kernel is updated.

 

Personally, I've got a Jellyfin instance running as well on a separate PC (also running Plex) and really?  I think Plex is just better.  Much more feature rich.  But to each their own.

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Hey at the risk of derailing the conversation a bit, has anyone attempted to do tests to see how well the Windows 11 scheduler deals with passing in a mixture of both P and E cores? How well it handles it? I know that a lot of folks just pass through all the P cores for gaming and what not, but I would love to see more data to see how/if kvm has gotten better at allocating the different cores to the host OS's scheduler. 

 

Thanks!

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8 hours ago, Waffleophagus said:

Hey at the risk of derailing the conversation a bit, has anyone attempted to do tests to see how well the Windows 11 scheduler deals with passing in a mixture of both P and E cores? How well it handles it? I know that a lot of folks just pass through all the P cores for gaming and what not, but I would love to see more data to see how/if kvm has gotten better at allocating the different cores to the host OS's scheduler. 

 

Thanks!

 

The last time I tried it was about a month and a half ago, and at least at that time, it was all sorts of borked. The QEMU folks are working on it though - the first kernel with support built in was 5.18, so it's not even fully supported by the hypervisor yet (6.10.3 is still 5.15; 5.18 still seems to have some 'teething' issues last I'd heard).

And just to be clear, by 'fully supported', I'm referring to the various alder lake specific components (IPI/thread director/et al) - doesn't mean it 'won't work', just that it 'won't function explicitly as designed'.

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10 hours ago, Waffleophagus said:

Hey at the risk of derailing the conversation a bit, has anyone attempted to do tests to see how well the Windows 11 scheduler deals with passing in a mixture of both P and E cores? How well it handles it? I know that a lot of folks just pass through all the P cores for gaming and what not, but I would love to see more data to see how/if kvm has gotten better at allocating the different cores to the host OS's scheduler. 

 

Thanks!

 

I had issue passing hyperthreaded cores to a w7 VM.  

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Does anyone have Unraid running with an Alder Lake CPU and a W680 chipset motherboard (such as the Supermicro MBD-X13SAE)? I'm currently using a Z690 board but I specifically went with an Alder Lake i9 because at the time they had just announced that it would also be supported on W680 boards once they were available. The idea being that I would have the ability to upgrade my MB and ram to DDR5 ECC (which W680 enables for Alder Lake i5, i7, & i9s) later on. As of now there are still only a couple W680 boards available but I'm curious if anyone has tried one with Unraid yet and what their experience has been.

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Saw 6.11.0-rc1 was out early this morning. HDR Tone Mapping still hangs trying to start playback. Disabling that but leaving HW transcoding enabled allows playback. Too early to comment about stability.

 

Edit: Just tried this from the plex docker's console:

apt-get install ocl-icd-libopencl1 beignet-opencl-icd

...and got:
beignet-opencl-icd is already the newest version (1.3.2-7build1).
ocl-icd-libopencl1 is already the newest version (2.2.11-1ubuntu1).
 

Edited by snazz
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1 hour ago, snazz said:

Saw 6.11.0-rc1 was out early this morning. HDR Tone Mapping still hangs trying to start playback. Disabling that but leaving HW transcoding enabled allows playback. Too early to comment about stability.

 

Edit: Just tried this from the plex docker's console:

apt-get install ocl-icd-libopencl1 beignet-opencl-icd

...and got:
beignet-opencl-icd is already the newest version (1.3.2-7build1).
ocl-icd-libopencl1 is already the newest version (2.2.11-1ubuntu1).
 

Sounds good.  I forget, is HDR more in unRAID’s side, or Plex’s?

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2 hours ago, snazz said:

Saw 6.11.0-rc1 was out early this morning. HDR Tone Mapping still hangs trying to start playback. Disabling that but leaving HW transcoding enabled allows playback. Too early to comment about stability.

 

Edit: Just tried this from the plex docker's console:

apt-get install ocl-icd-libopencl1 beignet-opencl-icd

...and got:
beignet-opencl-icd is already the newest version (1.3.2-7build1).
ocl-icd-libopencl1 is already the newest version (2.2.11-1ubuntu1).
 

I think you'll find that it isn't stable. :(

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1 hour ago, dchamb said:

It's getting really confusing. I have an Alder Lake system with an Asus 690 m/b ready to go for transitioning from my very old Ivy Lake system. I run primarily Plex but without HW transcoding. 

 

Would you make the switch if you were me?

Yeah, I get how it's confusing. I don't fully understand all this ICR stuff. Bottom line is that it's being worked on and it will eventually work. As far as your situation is concerned...if you still won't need HW transcoding after migrating to Alder Lake, then I'd say go for it. It will work fine without HW transcoding and would be a huge step up in performance from your Ivy Lake system.

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1 hour ago, dchamb said:

It's getting really confusing. I have an Alder Lake system with an Asus 690 m/b ready to go for transitioning from my very old Ivy Lake system. I run primarily Plex but without HW transcoding. 

 

Would you make the switch if you were me?

FWIW, this has been discussed repeatedly in this thread over the last couple of pages. If you're not using the iGPU, Alder Lake is just fine with Plex.

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3 hours ago, flyize said:

FWIW, this has been discussed repeatedly in this thread over the last couple of pages. If you're not using the iGPU, Alder Lake is just fine with Plex.

I understand it has discussed frequently and it also appears there is discussion to the contrary. I don't want to tear this system apart only to have regrets.

 

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13 minutes ago, dchamb said:

I understand it has discussed frequently and it also appears there is discussion to the contrary. I don't want to tear this system apart only to have regrets.

 

Then it sounds like no answer would satisfy you. I can tell you that I'm having no issues other than the iGPU and Plex. Good luck 👍

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