Announcing New Unraid OS License Keys

[jit-010101]

I had two Plus Licenses - just Upgraded one to Pro.

 

I can totally understand the change to the licensing model and will still purchase additional licenses as needed - with subscription fees and will still recommend it to anyone looking for a server/NAS/media OS.

 

There needs to be a steady income flow for you guys, to continue founding and development - otherwise there will be no more versions at a point in time.

 

I'm 100% sold and satisfied that Unraid is a much better general use home server system then any of the other options I've so far seen and used - for my use case (like, for example DSM - or heck much more complex setups like with Proxmox/k8s/or any of the countless server distros I've been trough in my years).

 

 

 

[Ricky_CheesyChips]

4 hours ago, JorgeB said:

Some good points, but not this part:

As already mentioned Unraid keys are not transferrable:

https://unraid.net/policies

First off: It's worth saying I have NO INTEREST in doing this. I don't want to give the impression I'm trying to be malicious here, I do like the product and think it's worth paying for, otherwise I wouldn't have bothered posting my essay-length analysis yesterday, I would have just moved to something else.

 

Unraid keys are not transferrable, by policy, sure, but there's a variety of grey market key resellers that already do this with a variety of online accounts, often hosted in countries that don't really have a legal framework that cares whether this is in direct contravention to vendor policies. There's no technical limitation preventing anyone from buying current-day licenses en masse to auction off on any one of these sites. We're not even talking dark web or anything, I can find a number of sites on google right now where I could buy a steam account preloaded with games. Grey market/black market doesn't care about the policy, it just cares about money.

 

[almostuser]

I hate posts like the one I am about to make when I see them in communities I'm active in, so apologies in advance for what I'm about to inflict upon you.  As a prospective unraid user who is literally sitting with a bunch of hardware lists about to start making purchases for what appears to be a fairly mid-sized system I am immediately ceasing my interest in purchasing an unraid license.

I simply will not go down the subscription route for any software if I can at all avoid it, and I'm particularly concerned that this policy change was apparently accidentally made public with Buy Once, Use for Life.  No subscription. No hidden fees still on the official website's pricing page. One wonders what other rugs might be pulled down the line now that the waters have been tested with this one. So, with that in mind, I will be moving my focus to one of a couple other vendors, no reason to name names.

Anyway, like I said, this probably won't be taken very well, and that's fine, but it is what it is.  Not trying to ruffle any feathers, just giving you an outside perspective from an almost user.   I do wish all of you, and the product, all the very best for the future but I won't be joining you.

[itimpi]

8 hours ago, almostuser said:

made public with Buy Once, Use for Life.  No subscription. No hidden fees still on the official website's pricing page.

It has already been said that this will remain true, but that there are going to be some new subscription based options available.  I have no idea why so many people seem to think that because there is going to be a subscription option in addition to the current offering that this is a huge downside.

[higundamhws]

Ok, limetech you got me.

 

Just buy the 2nd pro key for future use.

 

Hopefully u will not change your lifetime Promise to limit in future.

[Opawesome]

On 2/21/2024 at 10:48 AM, illone said:

Hello, I've never used Unraid before, but I'm about to build a server, and I would like to use Unraid. My question is, should I hurry up and buy a Pro for $129 and then I will get updates for life, I think it's better to buy now than to wait for the new licenses right?

I have been using Unraid for 4-5 years now, and I have just bought an extra pro licence just in case I would want to build another Unraid machine in the future. Although @limetech did stated that "pro/lifetime" licences would still be offered, it might be at a significant price increase. So I'd rather be safe than sorry.

 

As a user I obviously would have preferred that the pricing/lifetime license model stayed the same, but I also understand that Limetech is not a charity. And the least I can say, is that I don't feel having been robbed paying 129 USD for my Unraid licence.

Edited February 22 by Opawesome

[Opawesome]

1 hour ago, itimpi said:

It has already been said that this will remain true, but that there are going to be some new subscription based options available.  I have no idea why so many people seem to think that because there is going to be a subscription option in addition to the current offering that this is a huge downside.

Well, it will depend on whether the price of the lifetime license will stay around 130 USD or increase to 250 USD or more. I am not saying that limetech would do it, but if you give the choice between a 20 USD/year subscription or a 500 USD lifetime licence, you are not really offering lifetime licences anymore. I think people fear this kind of business model shift because of that.

Edited February 22 by Opawesome

[ocyberbum]

I guess for me i figured that this would need to happen also. I pay yearly for Plex, and BlueIris because i know my way around the software and new features that come out just enough to be dangerous...., i just had to update my phone to a S24 ultra to make sure i have the updates and features i wanted,  i pay monthly for my HomeyPro automation, DDNS and my Domains....+ all the other stuff i can't remember right now!!

The community, Dockers,  and Features that bring all my projects together is the reasons i believe Unraid is the best choice ... So if this is the answer to keeping Unraid operational for the future👍, Then i will add it to the list as long as i can justify its cost, because the idea of starting over may give me a fatal case of Insomnia!!!

[BVD]

2 hours ago, itimpi said:

I have no idea why so many people seem to think that because there is going to be a subscription option in addition to the current offering that this is a huge downside.

 

After re-reading the post, I think this comes down to how the announcement was worded - calling it a 'subscription' I don't think is quite right, as that term infers 'rental' in most people's minds. If instead they called it something like 'license support', that'd be more apt to have folks read it and have it reflect more of the ground reality I think...?

 

@limetech I was talking to a couple friends of mine here at work (enterprise data mgmt), where we've just recently been undergoing much the same change in revenue models (one time vs recurring), and when they read the announcement I linked their way (because only a fraction of a percent will watch the full podcast), the first responses I got back were all some form of "the enshittification of all things tech continues, not shocked"...

 

However after I explained a bit further (having listened to the podcast), they were much more amenable to the idea, and their only real issue was with the announcement itself for the most part. Some thoughts I'd had here:

 

• While I know that having time-based and calendar-locked recurring revenue makes things FAR simpler for all things fiscal (forecasting revenue, planning hiring, etc), I feel that the current sentiment towards such models is making this go down harder than is actually necessary.
• The way unraid handles releases is honestly a bit problematic for handling this any other way though, unfortunately (imo). There are often improvements/enhancements included with even point releases (which increases the potential for introducing new bugs), so there is no 'maintenance only' type of release. For example, 6.12's big feature was ZFS integration; but over the course of the last 8 point releases, we now have a new drivers page, new UI buttons to show/hide individual or all items at once, enhancements to package handling, etc.

Some recommendations towards the above:

• I'd propose LimeTech create a software support lifecycle policy - e.g. each major release of UnRAID shall receive continued support (e.g. bug fixes and security updates) for X term (I've been seeing 18 months as fairly typical, but 12 isn't unheard of). This gives an actual cadence that customers can then plan against, as opposed to paying for a 'period of upgradability', a term during which they've no idea what releases may or may not come
• Charge by major release instead of based on time period - This way, there's no 'unknown' in the customer's mind as to what they're receiving for what they've paid; they know exactly how long they are going to get security updates for and for exactly how much. 
• Only bug fixes allowed in point releases - Most mature software orgs I've worked with in the enterprise have a version schema something like "7.3.7-p3", where anything with the "-p#" is known solely to have included bug fixes found within that build (so for this example, 7.3.7 has had 3 bug-fix / security-patch releases). Since UnRAID doesn't follow such a schema, we'd instead have something like "6.13.2", where 6 is the major release (such as the big ZFS release), 13 is the minor/enhancement release (would include all the small enhancements normally in point releases currently), and 2 is the number of bug-fix/security-patch updates that it's received
• Possible LTS enabled by the above (oft req'd feature) - If moved to this new schema, Limetech could choose to finally implement the (seemingly heavily requested) option of an LTS UnRAID build (which would have to be an LTS kernel for it to make business sense to Limetech of course). Since you're charging based on the release, not the time window, you can opt to charge more for the LTS release in order towards offsetting the additional costs. Heck, you could even choose to do the time based revenue model initially proposed for these LTS releases, and since *no improvements* are included in point releases, this helps to mitigate some of the development overhead one might typically associate with such a strategy.

I know that these proposals are a fairly high bar, and may even appear a bit daunting at first read... But much of the additional work that'd be required can be augmented by build automation tools.

 

Argo or Flux CD could be built up to automate creating and validating these LTS point releases, for example, making maintaining two kernels far less painful than it otherwise could be. After the initial build-out's completed (and it'd take a little time there at least), it's associated costs effectively amount to a percentage of one DevOps guy's time thanks to the fact that much of the amazing features in UnRAID are plugin based (additionally helped further in that they're community supported).

 

I've got about a thousand ideas for all of this, but that's mostly as it's the world I live in at work each day, and while I know this wasn't short (...lol...), I hope at least some of it is some-kind-of helpful! Sincerely wishing all the Limetech folks the best as you're going through this transition 👍

[Michael_P]

4 hours ago, itimpi said:

I have no idea why so many people seem to think that because there is going to be a subscription option in addition to the current offering that this is a huge downside

 

Because a lot of us have been bitten by the 'boil the frog' type of transitions. 

[RacerX330]

6 hours ago, itimpi said:

It has already been said that this will remain true, but that there are going to be some new subscription based options available.  I have no idea why so many people seem to think that because there is going to be a subscription option in addition to the current offering that this is a huge downside.

 

Easy to answer.  Because we've seen this before.  pfSense comes to mind.

[itimpi]

28 minutes ago, RacerX330 said:

 

Easy to answer.  Because we've seen this before.  pfSense comes to mind.

Many people seem to be assuming that Limetech will not honour their statements on how they intend to proceed.   I think they will, and I see no reason to assume (as many are doing) that they will not.  I agree if they change things from what has been stated that may be another story, but why assume the worst from the outset? 

 

I have seen both types of subscriptions - those which are not a good deal or the terms keep changing, and those that are.  The good ones deserve support, particularity for products you re likely to be using every day.

[Terebi]

I completely understand the need for more revenue, as a "buy once" model indeed does not allow for the actual cost of maintenance. 

 

This doesn't personally affect me, as I have 2 lifetime licenses and am very unlikely to need more than that, but just thinking about the bigger problem space : 

 

* As others have mentioned, security patches

* CA won't even launch anymore on < 6.12. Assuming that pattern holds in the future, you could have a fully working system with apps, that you would never be able to install any new apps on, never upgrade any apps, and if you ever needed to reinstall an app or rebuild your server from scratch, you may not be able to get back to status quo.  ed : per responses, this is incorrect

 

I like the idea of feature locking instead of version locking that others suggested, as it removes the need to backport fixes into old versions, but still encourages upgrades for the new features. 

 

But if the intent is that "security/bug fixes" and "CA compatibility" requires the subscription fee, it would really depend on what the annual cost is, and being very up front that that is the model. 

Edited February 23 by Terebi
correction

[almostuser]

17 minutes ago, itimpi said:

Many people seem to be assuming that Limetech will not honour their statements on how they intend to proceed.   I think they will, and I see no reason to assume (as many are doing) that they will not.  I agree if they change things from what has been stated that may be another story, but why assume the worst from the outset?

This is a perfectly fine sentiment in a vacuum, but the current state of the industry and the pricing models being pushed suggest otherwise. Maybe Unraid really will be the lone shining beacon in a sea of garbage. Who knows, but in my experience, once you open that Pandora's box of "we're exploring a new subscription model," all bets are off, and it's full steam ahead towards more and more enshittification because number must go up.

[Frank1940]

31 minutes ago, almostuser said:

This is a perfectly fine sentiment in a vacuum, but the current state of the industry and the pricing models being pushed suggest otherwise. Maybe Unraid really will be the lone shining beacon in a sea of garbage. Who knows, but in my experience, once you open that Pandora's box of "we're exploring a new subscription model," all bets are off, and it's full steam ahead towards more and more enshittification because number must go up.

 

Might I suggest that you wait until the official announcement is made with details and pricing info.  Then you can make an analysis of the various options and decide at that point what you wish to do-- Buy a life time package (which you could do now), sign up for the software with periodic payments, or look for another option.

 

Personally, I find all the speculation of what will happen in the more distant future to be nothing more than a SWAG--- Stupid Wild A$$ Guess.  (Reminds of a boss that I once had who, when asked to provide an estimates of costs five years in the future, would look out the window and read the tail numbers off of the next plane in the landing pattern!)

 

I provide some support on the forum and I am shocked at the number of people who are running old Unraid releases.  Within the past couple of months of there was a request for assistance from a user wanting to upgrade from Version 5.X!  So this idea that you must absolutely have the latest security patches is not that big a concern to a lot of people.  As further proof of this, there are users who still want to use SBMv1 which has a major security hole that primarily affects home users.  (A lot of the security patches are more things that primary impact business, government, and corporate users.)

[EDACerton]

2 hours ago, Terebi said:

* CA won't even launch anymore on < 6.12. Assuming that pattern holds in the future, you could have a fully working system with apps, that you would never be able to install any new apps on, never upgrade any apps, and if you ever needed to reinstall an app or rebuild your server from scratch, you may not be able to get back to status quo.

For what it's worth, we're over a year away from this being a possible problem, and folks are already looking at how the app/plugin system can accommodate users that decide not to update.

[isvein]

First its not an subscription, its an update renewal cost.
Subscriptions, you loose access once you don't pay, like Adobe, any streaming platform, Backblaze, you cant cancel before you delete your backup and so on.
 

I don`t Tom wants to be like "anyone" else in the market, I believe he is honest when he says they listens to the community and when he said he don't want to go out an get investors.

Because if they did get investors, they would be FORCED to do the stupid things that everyone else is doing because "customers? no no, you cant listen to them! Who has the money? I the investor does! You need to do what I SAY now so I can get my money back"

[Squid]

4 hours ago, Terebi said:

CA won't even launch anymore on < 6.12

As previously mentioned, Not True.  Simply no more updates for CA running on 6.11

 

4 hours ago, Terebi said:

that you would never be able to install any new apps on, never upgrade any apps, and if you ever needed to reinstall an app or rebuild your server from scratch, you may not be able to get back to status quo. 

FWIW, Pretty much any version of CA which is currently running on the applicable OS version of Unraid (including going back to CA running on Unraid 6.0) does still work no problems.

 

And, FWIW my decision to drop 6.11 support came before I knew about the licensing changes.  It wouldn't have really mattered either way on dropping support though.

[BVD]

12 hours ago, Terebi said:

* CA won't even launch anymore on < 6.12

 

As mentioned above, it works - not sure where you got this information? If it's documented somewhere, that documentation is definitely incorrect (source: I'm running servers from 6.9.2 -> 6.11.5, all of which still work with CA just fine 👍)

[Hastur]

I ask one more time but in few less words:
does LT plan to increase pricing of upgrade licence key in near future for legacy users?

[Terebi]

11 hours ago, BVD said:

 

As mentioned above, it works - not sure where you got this information? If it's documented somewhere, that documentation is definitely incorrect (source: I'm running servers from 6.9.2 -> 6.11.5, all of which still work with CA just fine 👍)

 

It was vague communications/default messaging,  with a somewhat buried workaround posted week+ later that I hadn't seen.  I'm upgraded, so I can't see it anymore, but I swear the CA app itself gave a message saying 12 was required, and it did not mention old versions remaining available. 

 

 

[tech3475]

5 hours ago, Hastur said:

I ask one more time but in few less words:
does LT plan to increase pricing of upgrade licence key in near future for legacy users?

 

Yeah I'd like to know this as well since I might buy a basic key to have for potential future use, I don't want to buy it and then find it costs $200 to upgrade to pro.

[jsebright]

So, now that the discussion around new licensing is starting to ease off a bit, I'd like to ask the obvious question...

When can we see v7 and the next round of exciting new features?

[Veah]

2 minutes ago, tech3475 said:

 

Yeah I'd like to know this as well since I might buy a basic key to have for potential future use, I don't want to buy it and then find it costs $200 to upgrade to pro.

Seems clear to me the answer is either:

A) 'I don't know.'

B) ' I know, but you will not like my answer so I will not answer.'

[ddube]

You can do it if you want, but expect to have less customer than now.

 

Over the years, I have recommended unraid to many users but since I don't support subscription model, it will be the end of my free advertising. I can't move forward with that.

 

Good luck !